Sarah Palin's Questionable Judgment
Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin's an up-and-coming Republican leader who could've been an interesting presidential or vice presidential candidate in four or eight years. It is reckless insanity to believe she's ready to step in as commander-in-chief now, particularly to serve a 72-year-old president with health concerns after two bouts with skin cancer and five-and-a-half years' mistreatment as a prisoner of war.
Palin, only two years removed from being the mayor of Wasilla, Alaska (pop. 6,700), had to be told two months ago what the vice president does:
Larry Kudlow of CNBC's Kudlow & Co asked her about the possibility of becoming McCain's ticket mate.
Palin replied: "As for that VP talk all the time, I'll tell you, I still can't answer that question until somebody answers for me what is it exactly that the VP does every day?"
Because McCain did so little to familiarize himself with Palin -- he only met her once prior to this week -- and she's a little-known and untested politician from a low-populated state, I have a gut feeling that we're headed for another Thomas Eagleton situation where a vice presidential nominee is dropped before Election Day.
Start looking into Palin's life, as thousands of reporters and activists are now doing, and there's a strong undercurrent of weird. Some of it is charming, Northern Exposure stuff -- her parents were out caribou hunting when news broke of her selection as running mate -- but a lot of it makes you wonder how well anybody in the GOP vetted her. Some of McCain's advisers like Karl Rove are the same geniuses who thought Harriet Miers belonged on the Supreme Court.
One bit of weirdness associated with Palin concerns the birth of her youngest child. As the Alaskan media reported, Palin was attending an energy conference in Texas on April 18 when her water broke four weeks before her due date. After this happened, Palin didn't head to a hospital or even leave the conference, even though the premature rupture of fetal membranes is normally a cause for an immediate examination by an obstetrician, who will observe the fetus on a monitor to guard against infection and other life-threatening complications. Two other reasons for heightened concern were Palin's age, 43, and the fact that prenatal testing indicated the child had Down syndrome.
Palin stayed at the conference and delivered a 30-minute speech, then boarded a 12-hour Alaska Airlines flight from Dallas to Anchorage, neglecting to tell the airline her water had broken -- most airlines won't fly a woman in labor. The motivation for all of this appears to be the Palins' desire that the child be born in Alaska. Her husband Todd told the Anchorage Daily News, "You can't have a fish picker from Texas."
When she arrived home, Palin was hospitalized immediately and the baby was born prematurely after labor was induced in the middle of the night.
Maybe Palin's actions can be written off as Alaskan grit, since she's a macho hunting governor who jogs in freezing temperatures and dines on moose burgers. But as a parent myself, I think the Palins were extremely fortunate that their reckless stupidity did not end in tragedy. As middle-aged parents who already had four kids, the Palins had to be completely familiar with all the things that can go wrong in a pregnancy. One commenter on the Washington Times laid out the enormous risk she was taking:
Airlines are unequipped to handle most emergencies at 30,000 feet, particularly the kind Palin put her unborn child at markedly increased risk for. These emergencies include birthing a premature infant or uncontrolled maternal bleeding. This was her FIFTH pregnancy and delivery can happen rapidly and unexpectedly. The baby or Palin could easily have died.
In the ADN article Palin downplays her decision to fly, implying traveling was reasonable as she wasn't in labor. If so, then why was she immediately hospitalized after returning to Alaska? Why was there an induced delivery of a 36-week infant by 6:30 am soon after her return? Again, ask any OB doctor. Induced delivery of a premature infant ALWAYS indicates a problem. The two most likely would be fetal infection, (a likely event given her failure to seek meaningful medical attention for her baby) or fetal distress by monitor.
Ask your OB doctor if the risks Palin took with the life of her unborn child are risks they would have advised for ANY reason.
I'm sure that some people will consider raising this subject a cheap shot, since the child was born healthy and it all worked out for the Palins. But you have to question the judgment of a person who took so many risks with her life and that of her baby.
Update: People who are spreading the cruel rumor about Palin's pregnancy and her daughter should read this April 27 blog entry from a woman who shared a commercial flight out of Fairbanks, Alaska, with the governor in March. Elizabeth Eubanks writes that Palin was "pregnant (she has since had her baby) with bags and daughter in tote." A search of Google's cache confirms this entry has been unchanged since April.
Comments
There's a phrase "Catholic suicide" which refers to when depressed Catholics becoming "mishap prone" and their deaths ruled as accidents.
It may be that by taking such extreme risks Palin was attempting a "Fundamentalist abortion".
Could you please check your liberal feelings for a minite? Please your are trying to discredit this woman because she causes real concern for the Obama campaign. She has more experience in politics than Obama, even if it is at a local level. And she has been in a leasdership role, unlike Barrack Hussien Obama. If Obama thinks that his "experience as a community organizer" qualifies him, then why would her experience as a mayor, and memeber of the PTA not qualify her just as much. And as far as a heart beat away from the Presidency, Obama wants to be the president, and he has no foreign policy experience. Or wait let me see, I'll bet that you are counting his years growing up overseas, and the short trip that he took a few weeks back. If so then I'll go with the one who hunts and fishes and is a life long memeber in the NRA. No doubt she can handle her own. And she, not Obama is the one with the track record of fighting corruption and not associating herself with people like that. Can Obama say the same thing...oops Rev. Wright....oops Bill Ayers....oops Rezco, and let's not forget who is pulling the strings for Obama, Mayor Daley, a family whose name and political corruption are one in the same. And as far as her judgement with regards to her child, she kept the child when others would have aborted the baby. Where does Obama stand on that issue, he's in favor of infanticide. But he's the one, the messiah right? More like he is the antichrist.
Chad......if you live in NOLA wait for GUSTAV, that's all I have to say, hopefully.....
The running off and hospitalizing and inducing for the rupture of membranes is just more of that panicked way of viewing labor and delivery. I wouldn't think too much of it. (I'm not a supporter of Palin, but that is for POLITICAL reasons. Not this poke around how views pregnancy and delivery nonsense.)
Obama got his degree in international relations and has had four years of foreign policy experience as a member of the foreign relations committee. That's not zero foreign policy experience. It's certainly more than what Bush had when he became president. He also managed to predict all of the things that have gone wrong with regard to foreign policy well before even some of the most seasoned and experienced politicians ever even had a thought about the mess that has been created.
Who on this planet would abort their baby just because it wasn't going to be born in the state they wanted it to be born? Your statement is absolutely moronic. The fetuses that are aborted are those that are not wanted. Republicans love to make life more difficult for the little guy so as to make it almost impossible to afford to birth and care a child. You'll never stop abortions whether legal or illegal. The best you can do is create a situation where people won't be forced to choose between abortion or bringing your child up in poverty.
Of course, the messiah thing... Just like the other Republicans, you have no arguments for your own policies, only attacks against character. I understand though. You could never win in a policy debate. It's all you got left. I don't blame your for your desperation.
Of course, that behavior makes more sense if viewed through the prism of the rumor (I emphasize, rumor) that the baby was actually her granddaughter. Her 16 year old daughter is rumored to have missed several months of high school before that baby was born, Palin never really showed her (supposed) pregnancy, and the panicky attempt to get back to Alaska makes a lot more sense that way.
I realize this is all unfounded speculation and shouldn't be given any credence, but it kind of hangs together in a weird way.
Carlos......i dont know where you are, but if you are in my country then you need to go home. Or go play in traffic, hopefully...you miserable mestizo.
In response to Fernando's question of who would abort a baby because of the state that it would be born; some studies estimate (there is no firm data) that as many as 90% of pregnancies are terminated after finding out that the child will be born with Down Syndrome. I think those that choose to do that would fall into the category or "not wanting" the child.
As a medical professional who lives in Anchorage, I can safely assure you that this situation did in fact occur, and was reported in the April 22, 2008 Anchorage Daily News (www.ADN.com).
The medical community here in Anchorage was horrified of the news of this "heroic" adventure of Governor Palin. It was an incredibly egregious decision that risked the life of Palin's unborn child. It also set a poor example for others to follow....a public safety issue.
Several well-respected physicians spoke with my physician husband on different occasions and came up with the same conclusion: she was trying to kill the baby. No other reasonable explanation could be derived from this act of shear stupidity and shameless self-promotion. A Down's child would forever be a burden to her; many have already criticized her insatiable need for a national level political position over the necessity of raising a special needs child.
"Obama got his degree in international relations and has had four years of foreign policy experience as a member of the foreign relations committee."
NO, he actually had 140 days experience before he started campaigning for President. You must be getting his experience mixed up with his Aunty Joe who will be the new shadow president in the great style of Dick Cheney.
Wonderful!
Rogers sets the stage, and DBT delivers the partisan, political punchline! This is so revealing of your positioning vis a vis the DNC propaganda poop-shoot. Are you two well acquainted?
Of course, this "rumor" has nothing at all to do with politics, much less demonstrate anything at all to do with the nation's security or economics. Notice that the sensitively hypocritical Left will not hesitate to call anyone names who might mention a Democrat's children negatively, but spend years reviling a Republican president's daughters.
Indeed! You can depend on Democrats to start the "Rumor Mill" to defame and revile the other "team"; as if "winning" with their yellow-dog candidate is more important than our constitution or national security, and also revealing that their "sensitivity" is a flat out lie, too!
Disgusting tactics, and disgusting politics.
Palin's leadership experience is 4 years greater than is Obama's: fact. Neither have foreign relations experience, but one supports the defense of our nation using a strong military and taking the fight to our enemy... and the other one wants to quit when the uncooperative, antipatriotic Democrats start to whine and moan about the expense, and continue doing so for years, and with the goal of letting the enemy succeed. That's just another demonstration of what partisanly selfish misers they just happen to be as a collective.
The real difference is in the fact that Obama is running for president, sans experience, while the other is running for vice president, and not the world's strongest nation's leader. She will certainly have time to gain that experience as vice president.
Actually, that is the main fear now, and why yellow-dogs will continue to revile and defame another human being for team over nation - they fear that with 4 years of experience and a successful vice presidency, that she would beat Hillary, hands-down, next time around!
"Several well-respected physicians spoke with my physician husband on different occasions and came up with the same conclusion: she was trying to kill the baby."
Whoa! Aren't you into the "sensitive" smear-line? It was her daughter's bastard child! Are you dense?
No, certainly not! A physician's wife, at minimum, has a sense of economic worth ... so you're just putting some extra innuendo salad out there for the it-doesn't-have-anything-to-do-with-anything buffet!
Upper-class, physician's wife level, elitist rumor mongering!
This, of course, illustrates what the term "Progressive" actually means to those with an eye to see ...
TADOWE, you need a serious reality and fact check about experience. Does serving on the city council for a town with a population of under 7,000 is experience, does that set the foundation for foreign policy? Does serving as mayor of a town with a population under 7,000 provide the real experience to step into the role of President if needed?
Obama has:
1. Served as president of the Harvard Law Review
2. Served in the Illinois Senate from 1997 to 2004 (that's SEVEN years)
3. He was elected to the Senate in November 2004 (that's FOUR years of experience)
As a member of the Democratic minority in the 109th Congress, he helped create legislation to control conventional weapons and to promote greater public accountability in the use of federal funds. He also made official trips to Eastern Europe, the Middle East, and Africa. During the 110th Congress, he helped create legislation regarding lobbying and electoral fraud, climate change, nuclear terrorism, and care for returned U.S. military personnel.
Palin has:
1. Served on Wasilla City Council from 1992 to 1996
2. Served as Mayor of Wasilla from 1996 to 2002
3. Served as Govenor of Alask from 2006 to current
Obama's got significantly more experience with the skills needed to run our country. Biden balances AND strengthens the ticket.
One month ago, Sarah Palin did not know what the daily role of the VP was.
Is it in the best interest of our country to have someone with lightweight experience doing a job for which she didn't even know what the responsibilities were? Answer's crystal clear to me.
Obama lacks executive experience? What are you crazy? (Or just partisan!)
He has now run 3 large ad hoc enterprises that would be considered masterful if they were entirely in the business world.
His first enterprise was running a Senate campaign against the Chicago machine. Barack WAS NOT supposed to be the candidate for Senator the year he won it. The Chicago machine had picked someone else. Barack put together a machine and thru what can only be considered masterful executive management, by all but partisans, he reached his goal.
His second enterprise was putting together an election machine that took on one of the biggest machines in American politics today. He took on the Clinton's and the DLC. By all measures, this was significantly more difficult and more profound than running the state of Alaska. Again, simply masterful executive experience.
His 3rd enterprise is more accurately an outgrowth of the second one. He's doing better now against one of the best well oiled machines in American history: The Republican party. Nearly all the big money interests in America (the corporations) and the ruling elite all want the other guy. His leadership continues to be masterful as his enterprise is taking on all of these groups, and he is winning.
No executive experience? This is just crazy. It's obvious to *anyone who steps back and looks at what he has done, that this guy is masterful in his leadership skills, AKA administrative skills, AKA management skills, AKA Executive skills. And I'm not even including the leadership he demonstrated in the boroughs of Chicago as he tried to help the unemployed get jobs.
These campaigns meet the definition of a small business and even of a big business.
*to anyone without a personal interest in the other guy, who starts with a conclusion then goes looking for facts to support that conclusion.
All these bizarre rumors--but I guess you should expect it when an unknown is injected into the presidential race. I don't really care whether Palin subconsciously wanted that poor baby to die, or if she used her influence to fire her brother-in-law. As a moderate Republican woman, I was looking forward to casting my vote for McCain in the fall. I expect two things of a president: Keep us safe and keep our taxes reasonably low. I believed I could trust McCain to do both. His selection of Palin--who is probably a nice woman but clearly in over her head--tells me that McCain is more concerned about throwing red meat to the party's evangelical base than he is with keeping us safe. I am shocked and furious. Guess I'll throw my vote away on the Libertarians as a protest. I can't support the Dems because of higher taxes, and I would never trust Palin with national security at this dangerous time in our history.
Erica, If you think McCain will keep us safe, you've been listening to your preachers or watching Faux News too much.
Violence against American interests have skyrocketed since we invaded Iraq. Membership in Al Quiada continues to grow massively.
The first Al Quiada attack on American soil was in 1993. The second one in 2001. That's 8 years. So if you think Bush has been wonderful for America because there has been no Al Quiada attacks in 7 years, then you must love Clinton for the 8 years he did the same thing.
I suspect you don't love Clinton for this, nor should you. Time is not the measure. The Sunni's and the Shiites have been warring for 1000 years.
So please, look at reality, not time. Look at the world and look at the billions we are wasting. If those billions had been invested in solar and wind, we would already be energy sufficient, and this would impoverish the Arabs states that need our money to fund their terror.
A 3rd Bush administration is the exact opposite of what we need to do for the safety of nation.
Oh, and as for taxes, reality tells us that Republcian have never lowered taxes for the overwhelming majority of Americans, only for the rich. Republicans are very good at shifting taxes. Shifting those taxes to the middle class, shifting those taxes to the states, and shifting those taxes to local property taxes. And shifting those taxes to the future. At the end of RR's 8 years, taxes for the overwhelming majority of Americans were substantially higher. They were substantially lower for only one group. The rich.
When you study tax rates, you cannot consider ONLY federal income taxes. When you study ALL the taxes that ALL the people pay, including fees and what not, Republicans have always managed to shift them onto the middle class.
The only party that has lowered taxes for common people, when you consider ALL the taxes that common Americans pay, is the Democratic party. Don't swallow the propaganda. Look at ALL the taxes and fees. Add them ALL up.
And don't forget the price of gasoline, the costs of inflation, and other costs.
When you look at the entire picture, it's the Democratic party that has helped the common people, who are the real backbone of this nation.
Erm.. so, what is the daily role of a vice president? Apart from being there as a backup if something goes wrong with the no 1?
That and being a tie-breaker if needed in the Senate are not describing what a VP actually has to do most days in the year :)
Oh, and that 90% figure on Down abortions might be a bit inflated, it doesn't count the people at risk who don't want to get tested early in the pregnancy.
Neither of these comments should be seen as endorsements of Palin BTW.
Ummm - she's light on experience, but she's got a lot more than Obama. Politics aside, he's spent his brief career working very hard to not vote on much at all.
If you want to argue that Palin is a lightweight on experience, then you should feel even more nervous about Obama.
Erica,
Why do you like Republicans if you're interested in avoiding higher taxes? In 2000-2008 entitlements increased by a factor eight and the national debt became astronomical. Most of this increase came during 2000-2004 when Republicans controlled both houses of Congress. Half of the wealth created in the last eight years under Republican leadership has accrued to the richest 0.25% of Americans. That injustice and callousness is a policy for disaster. Now our grandchildren owe the government $200K each on the day that they're born. Count this up for a family of three children and nine grandchildren. They don't have a better educational system because Republicans want to test schools instead of improving teacher student ratios. They don't have an energy conservation policy because Republicans want to let the market take care of it (i.e. not increase auto mileage standards for cars since 1983 and exempt light trucks and SUVs). They don't have a sound banking system because Republicans believe that banks should be able to concoct fradulent schemes dreamed up to enrich their CEOs. They don't have clean air to breath in our major cities because the Republicans relax clean air standards. They don't have jobs because Republicans give tax breaks to companies that send jobs overseas. All our familes have to show for Republican financal extravagance is that they can go look at the big homes owned by rich people whose "welfare for the rich" policy enabled them to own five or more houses as big as the small hotels I can afford to stay at. Republicans are good at labeling Dems as "tax and spend" when in reality Republicans should be called "borrow and spend more to benefit super-rich people." Four more years of this will be the end of America as we know it. Everyone should take heed. All Republicans should be voted out of office.
For those who haven't heard, it appears likely that she was never pregnant (try and find a picture of her showing - there aren't any). Her 16 year old daughter on the other hand started "showing" in December, and was suddenly pulled out of school with "mono" for five months. Get the picture? The gov has a new granddaughter but she's pretendng it's hers for "family honor." This will be in the mainstream media soon.
Maybe she was able to take the risk because it was her 16 year old daughter that was in labor, not her. Plently of rumours flying here in Alaska, best bring yourself up to speed.
Why would labor be induced if the waters had broken?
Ummm - she's light on experience, but she's got a lot more than Obama.
I can't believe people can say that with a straight face. Twenty months ago she was mayor of a town of 6,700 people. There are more than 100 cities in Illinois larger than that.
Mrs. Palin is a tough and wonderful lady. I hope her personal life is not mauled over by the press. She is ok and I say to leave her alone to be even stronger for our country. Maralyn
Unless, or course, she wasn't pregnant. Rushing home to be there for your daughter's early labor would be a commendable reason to get on that plane.
For your own labor, or even labor possibility, it was an horrendous reason to get on that plane.
But then again, horrible judgment just might be a requirement for a Republican candidate nowadays.
David Perfect,
There is only one reason labor would be induced if the water had broken. And that would be if the baby were in trouble or if you were near 9 months already.
At 7 months, the goal would be to prevent active labor for as many days and weeks as possible.
Thus, the very poor judgment Gov Palin showed by getting on that plane.
Regarding Palin's baby, here's a shocking update to this breaking story.
Oh, wait, wrong year.
The baby was never in danger because he never left Alaska. You do the math.
Can someone PLEASE tell me -- if the Republicans guarantee me lower taxes and I have to pay $5 a gallon in gas and therefore can't fill up my tank to get to work, but then my company outsources my job to India and the bank forecloses on my home, then the Republicans borrow Billions of dollars from the Chinese to finance a war in Iraq that my brother died in, and we end up staying in Iraq for 100 years and Russia gets irate with us and moves atomic missiles into Cuba, while my grandma in New Orleans STILL doesn't have a home to live in after 3 years and I turn 65 and try to retire only to be told that my 401k has lost 85% of its value but the CEO of the money market fund I was invested in is in jail while his CFO just bought a mansion on an island in the Caribbean and my Social Security "entitlement" is only $125 a month --- then just HOW MUCH money do I have each month to live on?
Mark & David,
Clearly you men know nothing about labor & birth. If a woman's labor does not progress after her water breaks she will be induced to prevent infection, which poses a serious risk to the baby.
-Sue, who won't vote for Palin because of her positions on the ISSUES!
You forgot to mention how our roads and our schools are collapsing. And how our property taxes and local fees are skyrocketing.
And how the National debt is exploding and will need to be paid for by our kids.
Again, people, reality tells us that Republicans lower taxes only for the rich. They shift them to everyone else, and they shift them to our kids. We now have 30 years of data proving this, but you won't get this from the corporate media. And after they pass Net Neutrality, you won't get this info from the internet either.
When Federal tax rates go down, state taxes and local taxes invariably have to go up to compensate the lack of federal assitance in local projects. This is how the world works. So when Bush lowers taxes, primarily for the rich, that burden gets pushed to non progressive taxes that hurt the middle class.
It's a fact that this has happened and the data on the Bush administration's doing this is just now coming together.
The data on how the Reagan administration, and the first Bush administration did exactly this is out there and clearly shows this.
And the collapse of our schools... We will pay for this and we will pay dearly for this.
Do you think the Republican leaders are destroying our schools on purpose in order to turn us all back into low paid assembly line workers? Is this their plan to deal with the progress going on in China.
Can anyone thin of a better explanation?
As an American expat who has lived in Australia for quite a while, I am often in the position of explaining the whys and wherefores of American politics to people here. This latest event has caused me some challenge both as a supporter of the US democratic process and the presidential system (we have parliamentary politics here where the parties select their leaders after voters put their representatives into office) and as a woman.
I found it shocking that John McCain chose Sarah Palin in the first place because it seemed such a cynical attempt to woo votes due to their gender. Frankly, I was insulted.
I am also a mother and find Palin's views and behaviour quite contradictory. While she is pro life (I am pro choice so disagree with her there) and extols the value of every child, she chose to go back to work 3 days after Trig's birth. Now she is going to be on the presidential campaign trail for months. If she was a man, I guess I'd also be wondering how the family was coping.
After the births of my 3 children, I wanted to stay home as long as possible. Although I did go back to work after all of them I have always struggled to maintain a balance between family and work commitments and really don't find it easy. I think that most women don't.
As I learn more about her, I find her attitude towards her family and others quite irresponsible. Not only did Sarah Palin put her baby and herself at risk by getting on that plane, she put the other passengers at risk too. Having a baby on an airplane would require a great deal of assistance from crew and possibly an emergency landing en route. Her judgement affects more than just herself.
As for her experience in the 'executive,' her world is a long way from the world of Washington, DC and international politics.
I question her ability to make logical and informed decisions under pressure.
Obama may have some deficiencies but along with Biden, I think his ticket is the more stable one to make big decisions for all of us.
I THINK SHE IS THE BEST,I WANT A RUCKY LIKE HER,SHE IS GOING TO BE THE BEST VICE PRESIDENT EVER.
SHE IS GOING TO GET RID OF ALL THE LOBBY IN WASHINGTON,I FELT GREAT YESTERDAY ,LIKE BEING BORN AGAIN
Susan reasons (how refreshing), "... Does serving on the city council for a town with a population of under 7,000 is experience, does that set the foundation for foreign policy?"
No one said it did. Your strawman argument is so obviously a misdirection.
"Does serving as mayor of a town with a population under 7,000 provide the real experience to step into the role of President if needed?"
It provides more *leadership* (hello?) experience than Obama has. Is it impossible for you to recognize that, at any level of understanding?
"Obama has: 1. Served as president of the Harvard Law Review"
Editorial experience, and which is a non-sequitur (if not another obvious misdirection).
"2. Served in the Illinois Senate from 1997 to 2004 (that's SEVEN years)"
Which provides him with what? What laws did Obama propose? What laws did Obama vote on? What laws has Palin proposed, or made decisions about? In reality, the legislative experience isn't pertinent to either president or vice presidental positions; however enhancing it may be on a lobbyist's resume.
"3. He was elected to the Senate in November 2004 (that's FOUR years of experience)"
As has been already observed, he has 140 actual days of legislative experience, and again, what laws has Obama proposed/sponsored, what laws has he voted on? Those are certainly pertinent questions as to his qualifications for the office, but has no relationship to Palin's. Nice triple threat sleight-of-hand, misdirection, though.
"As a member of the Democratic minority in the 109th Congress, he helped create legislation to control conventional weapons and to promote greater public accountability in the use of federal funds."
Palin is supportive of the 2d Amendment ... so? I'll bet you won't chance a wager on whether Palin might have proposed greater accountability in spending? Since she already has, and quite famously? No, you just weren't thinking about that ... as is the habit with shallow progressives.
As I've mentioned more than just once, you partisans-uber-nation are destroying the Democratic party ... which used to be one of patriotism and defense of liberty around the world. Now, you whiners have turnd it into a party of quitters for votes; party over nation war profiteers for votes.
The whole nation is disgusted ... and you'll soon see the results of your partisan, Progressive cupidity ...
Sue,
I work in healthcare and know full well that the majority of the time childbirth is induced when the water breaks.
But when the baby is 2 months early, they would try to postpone labor.
My wife went into labor 2 months early and they tried to delay labor. I was there. I saw it. I watched the drugs get placed in her IV. In fact, I helped insert that IV.
In this day and age, in this circumstance, the mother would get admitted to the hospital and both the baby and the mother would be put on monitors. The baby thru it's scalp. If contractions started, serious consideration would be made to stop it, like in the case of my wife. (We had twins and they are perfect.)
They would stay like this for days or weeks, as long as both remained fine.
There are some reports that Palin was 8 months pregnant and not 7 months. At 8 months they would likely induce, but at 7, they would likely NOT.
But if she were 8 months, there is not an Obstetrician on the planet who would approve of Gov Palin flying to Texas with a Down's baby in her Uterus and being over 40 years old.
The more I read about this birth the more I am appalled by her judgment. The only way I would be relieved would be to find out that she was not the one pregnant and this was but a cover story to protect her child. But then it wouldn't be a judgment issue, it would be an honesty issue. She'd of been better off saying zip, nada, nothing. The new baby could have entered her household with nothing being said.
Oh, and thanks for the link to babycenter.com. Although it is written by lay people, I still think what this article points out is the imperative to go to the hospital when your water breaks. And it reinforces Palin's poor judgment in this case.
However, your apparent conclusion that this article states such cases need be induced in all cases is not correct. It makes no such blanket statement.
And I won't vote for Palin because of her stand on the issues as well. But McCain has made a great big thing about judgment. It's been a cornerstone of his campaign. Personally, I think he has shown poor judgment over and over. Picking Palin is just another example of that poor judgment.
The selection of Palin is patently absurd. I am insulted as a woman the more I read about her measurements, oops...work experience. I have haunting images of a 3 am call to her when McCainiac is routinely retooled and she asks Who? Where?
If the grandson theory is correct, publically living the lie would guarantee emotional sickness to the family. How would this relate to her professional duties?
It is time for Right to Life to profoundly consider the parameters of the unintended consequences of zealotry.
Consider the life of the mother on the front lines of a war of greed.
We must live in the world of reality.
ugh, unsubscribe from anything rogers cadenhead, forever.
"The more I read about this birth the more I am appalled by her judgment."
Here is the crux of the whole Progressive hypocrisy - it is perfectly okay, and a sound judgement to terminate the birth of your unborn fetus for personal, however selfish, reasons, but it is some sort of horrible crime against judgement to "endanger" the life of a fetus (but only if a member of the opposition party - otherwise, if a Democrat or even a moderate, it might be for the "best").
You all literally cannot see yourselves, as the normal half of America observes you! Bald faced hypocrites who can be counted on for one thing - you'll revile and dehumanize for votes ...
Next, along with the marble columns and wildly gesticulating crowd, you'll have some slogan to go along with the goosestepping agreement to hate and despise your anti-socialist opponents.
How about, "Victory for Welfare!"?
This is nothing but a cheap shot by a Cadenhack.
I guess your idea of good judegemnt is befreinding unrepentant terrorists, making anti American hate mongers your spiritual leader, and getting invovled with convicted felons on shady land deals.
You're nothing but a leftwing pawn Rogers.
"ugh, unsubscribe from anything rogers cadenhead, forever."
I must disagree with your decision. I think Rogers is one of the more reasonable yellow-dog-Democrats; as oxymoronic as that might sound. Indeed, I think his presentation of an opportunity to answer the propaganda he feels it necessary to pass on to the public is admirable. Many of his referenced sites, here and the Drudge Retort, moderate and won't even allow my comments! It is a credit to Rogers' basic honesty that he supports the debate.
Besides that, he has made himself a success, and not depended on a business, or service to provide justification for his self-worth (not that doing that is any sin, mind you). I admire that, also. His 'stuff' is excellent, and he promises endless help in the field of his expertise.
His support of his politics is shy and timid, though, and which hesitancey means, I'm sure, that he can't be rotten to the normal yellow-dog-core, either ... there's some chance to hope for his mind after all, and however faint ...
Sarah Palin received the Down Syndrome diagnosis in Dec. 2007 (four months pregnant) according to this article:
This water breaking / daughter's baby shiite is just another load of stupid liberal crap.
I thought you libs were all for "women"?
I guess you are as long as they abort their "fetuses", huh?
What a joke!
"If the grandson theory is correct, publically living the lie would guarantee emotional sickness to the family."
But, having two moms or dads for parents is life sustaining and a boost to the social standing of any child of that make-believe marriage ...
You hypocrites are totally unconscious and such inveterate, backstabbing whiners it defies description ... how can you stand the stink your collective exudes?
All signs point to this being the 16 year old daughter's baby. YIKES.
I feel terribly for the Palin family. At least explains the creepy, awkward vibe they are giving off...and I can now feel sympathy rather than disgust. She is an undereducated rookie* caught in a web of lies and hubris. It's Edwards all over again.
(*by contrast, Obama graduated with his political/international relations degree from Columbia in '83, and has spent the intervening 25 years studying the law at Harvard, managing their prestigious Law Review, working at a top NYC think tank, acting as a civil rights attorney, lecturing on Constitutional law, working in community organizing, and serving in then State and then Federal Senates...I'd love to be this inexperienced.)
This is my first time visiting this site, and I won't be back. Your post is absolutely sick.
Have you no shame at all? Where's your sense of decency?
C'mon guys. We're shooting ourselves in the foot. Look at the contrasts people will be able to draw to the undecided voters based on this attituded.
From Colmes' linke to your story (a commenter wrote):
Of course, Alan, had she went to a medical provider who crushed the baby's head with forceps and vacuumed out the fragments and remaining tissue, she'd be a progressive exercising her reproductive choice, right?
And if during such procedure, the fetus were to emerge live born, Barak Obama would support the right of the physicians to let it die on the table.
But you want to talk about her prenatal care in conformance with the advice of her personal physician.
The last thing we need is someone to provide an easy segway to the most difficult aspect (late term) of choice policy to support to the moderate voters. Palin and McStain have POLICY problems. POLICY issues we clean their clock with.
Ugh.
"Palin and McStain have POLICY problems. POLICY issues we clean their clock with."
What a chance to mention even just one (1) of those ... but faint heart n'er won fair maiden ... (if you're a mom pair, or a dad pair that so elevates their children's social status above Palin's, and so assists their mental well being, then ignore the last comment ...)
Mickey:
The only reason Barack Obama voted against that bill was because he, as an educated Constitutional scholar, recognized baiting and slippery-slope language intended to violate the rights of pro-choice individuals in this country.
Sorry but...majority rule...minority rights. This is as the founding fathers would have it be.
These horrific procedures are incredibly rare and do not occur in casual or opportunistic circumstances.
Why can't right wingers see that there is no difference between your right to bear arms and a woman's right to make decisions for her body? it is using the government to protect our rights, not infringe upon them.
It is then up to us to moderate the misuse of guns and abortions by screwed up people, and keep loss of life to a minimum.
Folks,
The words in the block quote aren't mine.
They are a comment over at Alan Colmes.
"Visitor" I am afraid I cannot begin to get the cryptic point of your post. I'm not going to go on a list of the policy issues here. I've been doing that all day elsewhere.
But to my dismay, my fellow travelers want to do stupid things like suggest this lady was trying to kill the child based on innuendo and the like. And its generating comments, like those I quoted, that I believe are going to resonate to our peril with the undecideds that will decide this election. I happen to agree with Barak Obama's position on the bill in question. But if you guys cannot see how questioning this woman's pre-birth behavior simply lobs a slow-ball over the plate for the 'pugs to parlay into more discussion of their characterization of the "doctors 'right' to let live born abortion fetuses die on the table" smear, then you guys are just dense.
And since when do we second guess this stuff. That's the purview of the fundies on the right. Its very unseemly. I personally know a dozen people who returned to work early, or who didn't breastfeed, or who took a business or education related trip even though it was risky in the last few weeks of a pregnancy.
Since we are not privy to the discussions between THIS woman and HER doctor, we should shut the hell up.
My $0.02 but feel free to shout me down. The progress of progressives has not been on display lately. Just a lot of hate and vitriol.
"... Barack Obama ... an educated Constitutional scholar, recognized (the) language intended to violate the rights of pro-choice individuals in this country."
There is no constitutional language defining a woman's right to abortion. In that regard, the right to do murder was not given as a right to the federal government in the constitution; however, it was not thereby granted to the states or individuals, either. The court has no legal ability to construct a "right" which has been universally banned in every civilized society; before the present where an elitist socialism practiced by a subversive few on the SC invented such a right to infanticide; calling it "choice".
Now, the scurrilous idiots think that murder after birth is some sort of legitimate "right" to debate ...
How about those who are selfishly using up SS benefits? Why shouldn't there be a "right" for the government to put them out of their expensive misery? What a burden! Worse than an infant!
Support the Right to End the Misery of the Old and Useless
We Did It for Abortion We Can Do It for Euthanasia
"Sorry but...majority rule...minority rights. This is as the founding fathers would have it be."
They indicated that this would be the decision of states and the citizens of those various states of the republic. Your efforts are to deny any such decision by the people and the states. That's SC tyranny supported by the selfish desire not to be burdened with children, but unwilling to take the steps necessary to preculude such occurences. The drafter's of our constitution wanted the people to decide by vote ... not SC declaration of a right that the vast majority of the world's civilizations had banned, up until then ...
"These horrific procedures are incredibly rare and do not occur in casual or opportunistic circumstances."
Sure, sure, it only occurs at the selfish decision of the person carrying the child ... then, the skull is shattered and the brains sucked-out to accomplish a murder of a viable human being.
That's it ... you all are such disgusting, self-excusing, amoral sociopaths ... it is sickening to realize that it is your kind's immorality which caused the zealots of Islam to attack the USA; they see our corruptions as proving we are the "Great Satan".
Progressives have caused the terrorism of Islam with their infanticide, state torture of the handicapped, homosexuality and their other constant immoralities ... not buying oil ... but you blinkered Equus asinii are braying to loud to hear the truth ...
Instead, you attack fellow Americans, calling them fascists and nazis. You attack fellow Americans, calling them warmongers and racists. You attack fellow Americans in support of the very enemy we are fighting in wanting to quit and let them have the victory ... just so Democrats can make a few votes out of their anti-patriotic betrayal. And ... they undermine the success of that war for 4 years, wanting to resign, quit, give-up and surrender to terrorism.
What despicable partisans Progressives have become in their socialistic urge for power ...
So, let me get this straight. You support a woman's right to choose an abortion. But you do not support a woman's right to choose a flight to Alaska.
Wow.
As a Republican, I hope you keep pushing this attack. But as a human being, I hope you develop a basic sense of decency.
Scum attack by a left wing hack. More is on the way.
""Visitor" I am afraid I cannot begin to get the cryptic point of your post. I'm not going to go on a list of the policy issues here. I've been doing that all day elsewhere."
Please, who are you fooling? There aren't any major differences, except the security of our nation in providing for stable democracy in the ME. Democrats wish to abandon one such democracy in order for it to be a "loss" for a Republican president and result in the votes that can be garnered from "winning" by losing in Iraq.
The other issues are so filled with angst, that you Progressives don't dare bring them up, and since they have absolutely no sense to them, whatsoever ... increasing taxes for a supposed recession, for instance ... how stupid do you think all Americans are?
...and, is that the purpose of our socialized public school system? To utterly destroy the level of knowledge of the children of the USA? A union and progressive plot to create a society of mindless sheep?
Then, you patronizing prigs can rule without fear of revolt, since you will have removed all guns along and have society divided into male-male and female-female parented families ...
What a communist paradise that will be ... all the unaccountable sexual license possible, and abortion on demand until the fetus is 18 ... or over 75 ...
How disgusting to comment on Palin's delivery. Have you ever given birth? Yes, once the water breaks, there is an increased chance of infection. Do you have any idea as to how many ways there are to reduce the risk? The baby had no infection which means she did all the right things. Until you have the desire to learn what being a woman means, you have no right to critize or pretend you understand. It's time for you to shut your mouth about being a woman and accept us.
This article and most of these comments are amazing in their hypocrisy.
Since when do a bunch of liberals give the first crap about an unborn baby?
It would be amusing if it weren't so pathetic and disgusting.
Have you ever given birth?
My wife and I have three kids, and we've recently had a close relative whose newborn struggled with Group B strep but was fortunate enough to fight off the infection after weeks of struggle.
I knew I was lining myself for an ass-kicking by broaching this subject, but I think the Palins' decision was so unorthodox (and unsafe) it merited scrutiny. Sarah Palin aspires to be one heartbeat from the button. Her bizarre actions in a personal health crisis worked out fine, but they make me wonder what other weirdness will be uncovered in the vetting she never got from the McCain campaign.
"Her bizarre actions in a personal health crisis, though in hindsight worked out just fine, make me wonder what other weirdness will be uncovered in the vetting she never got from the McCain campaign."
Ahem...begs the question? Your logical flaws are showing, as well as your clear, liberal bias. How do you know for a FACT that she never got vetted? Hmm?
You should worry about your own candidate's problems. At least Sarah Palin never allowed an unrepentant terrorist to blog on her campaign website.
Interestingly, I found articles in websites involving Gov. Palin, L. Green , Stevens, Moynehan and her ex-brother-in-law, "scrubbed, removed and/or no longer available for view. Hmmm. "Vintage" Republican philosophy, "cover it up and by any means necessary".
Look, McCain is a 72 year old cancer survivor who appointed Gov Palin as V.P. who is without foreign policy experience, relatively unknown and has the "Troopergate" investigation" hanging in the wings. Now,, it is rumored that her infant son may not be hers but her daughter's? Something is very, very shady in regards to this appointment. Vote Republican??? No way, no how, no more "McCrooks".
How do you know for a FACT that she never got vetted?
A bunch of prominent Alaska Republicans are saying in the press that nobody they know was contacted by the McCain campaign to inquire about Palin, which is why they were so shocked at the pick.
A bunch of prominent Alaska Republicans are saying in the press that nobody they know was contacted by the McCain campaign to inquire about Palin, which is why they were so shocked at the pick.
Names and links. That's how we're supposed to do things around here. Otherwise you're just living up to your "glistening" reputation as a rumor monger. You're the one who "begged the question," so it's up to you to validate your claim. Or are you just following in Dan Rather's and Mary Mapes' footsteps, i.e. prove that your claim is false otherwise assume it's true?
Last time I checked, background checks don't have to go through "a bunch of prominent Alaska Republicans."
Heck, her own staff didn't know she was being selected until Friday.
I'm not going to jump through hoops for you, dude. I may compose a weblog post about the lack of vetting later, but in the meantime Google News is your friend.
Yea, heck, if the 'Alaskan republicans' say she wasn't vetted. It must be true!
Ahahahahhahaha.....Unreal
How dumb can you get?
You gotta love Obama's "new politics" -- it's so uplifting!
Great sourcing on this 'hard hitting' piece of journalism. I'm sure your profeesors would be proud.
I thought liberals were for empowering women, not calling them lying whores with bad judgement.
What a shocking turn of events. pfffffftttttt
Last time I checked, background checks don't have to go through "a bunch of prominent Alaska Republicans."
When the person being checked is Alaska's Republican governor, how could they not? What kind of vetting wouldn't include sending people to Alaska to talk up Republicans and make sure that Palin didn't have any skeletons in her closet that could embarrass McCain?
McCain knew exactly what he was doing and it worked perfectly.
He knocked the 'choosen one' right of the front page and ruined Hussein's big adventure.
More slanders and lies to come.
I figured out where the hot blast of anger is coming from. We've been invaded by Malkinites.
Chad,
Talk about an unbiased and well informed blog comment. Hearty applause from someone who considers themselves to have a good head screwed on their shoulders as well. Keep up the good work. Grassroots can make this happen! Let's go McCain! Let's win over all those simpleton women with our VP candidate. Women relate to women, it's as simple as that. This is the ticket for the 21 century! November here we come!
NOW WAIT A MINUTE. Kos says this is not Sarahs baby, that Sarah was not pregnant!! Please make up your minds as to which fantasy you are going to sucker into, tools. LEFTIE MOTTO: EEEK EEEEK truth EEEKKK truth run and hide run and hide.
Tell me what makes lefties, all lefties, too weak to cope with reality?? Why all the fantasies?? Whats the bip dips?
I realize you can only repeat what you are told to repeat, but maybe you should try to think for yourself, its not all that hard.
I bet it was Darth Cheney under building 7.
Hahahahahaha,.......I love it, the lefties are collapsing under the weight of their own hatred.
Colmes sold you out Rogers, and think of all that great work we did together on the old Alan Colmes threads at the Retort.
Roger,
Let me say that you are scraping the gutter with this whole post.
Instead of talking about policy, we are talking about the birth of her youngest son in a manner which has absolutely no bearing on government decisions. None, zip, nadda.
The only thing it does is try to frame Palin as someone she isnt and at worst, spread lies.
Let me enlighten you a little bit here about premature children and water breakage.
Without getting into too much personal detail, lets just say I am experienced in this matter and to be blunt, it doesnt take a PHD to figure elements of this out.
When a woman's water breaks the baby is coming. No ifs ands or buts.
Should Palin have went to the hospital? In my view it would have been prudent - but you know - none of us know her body and she did apparently talk to a physician.
It should also be noted that she had to be induced. That should tell you something.
In the end there were no complications, where there? That should be good enough, but of course it isnt because you want to make something up that aint there.
I do appreciate your post in one way, though. It defeats one of the other smears and lies which Democrats are trying to promote - that the child was her eldest daughters.
For making the case that the child was indeed hers, I appreciate.
It is not necessarily true that premature "water breaking" always involves immediate medical attention. I had my water break (at 34 weeks on a Monday evening). I called the doctor. He said wait to see if I went into labor. He set up an appointment for me to see him the following day if I didn't go into labor between Monday evening and the appointment the next day. It was a while ago that I had this happen, but I am under the impression they may give it up to 24 hours to see what happens before inducing.
This is it? This is the best that the libs can come up with on this candidate?! Oh my gosh, they are befuddled and will be runnin' scared from here on out. Kudos to the con strategist who pulled her name up. Can you even imagine the acidic spewings that lib journalists would be making if this pregnancy stuff was being said about Michelle instead?
Libs have once again placed priority on symbolism over substance and they are beginning to notice that their man is mostly an empty shirt with nothing more than the right color and classic rhetoric. One last thing...why do they keep comparing Sarah to Barack when the latter is running against John?! They got nuthin'...lol.
Have been encountering rumors all over the Internet about Trig Palin and the possibility that his mother might not be Sarah Palin, but might in reality be Sarah's daughter, Bristol.
This is a weird but intriguing notion, especially when one reads the various "theories" and "facts" involved. Either Sarah Palin is the mother, or her daughter is the mother. They cannot both be the physical mother of the child, which is almost the impression one gets in reading some of the theories--especially those involving the breaking of the water and subsequent flight back to Alaska, where the child was born.
The daughter apparently stopped going to school in December--at the four-month mark--which is also around the time that Sarah learned the child had Down Syndrome. It is conceivable (pardon the pun!) that Sarah's reaction (had the Doctor tell her the news on the phone, then researched Down Syndrome) was to the news that her DAUGHTER's child had Down Syndrome.
So far, either Sarah or the daughter *COULD BE* the mother.
There's just ONE thing that does not add up:
Everyone says Sarah did NOT look like she was pregnant, even late in the pregnancy. And some online photos DEFINITELY show the daughter with a rather protruding belly and rather "blossoming" breasts!
The MYSTERY: *WHY* would Sarah Palin, if she was trying to cover up her daughter's pregnancy, permit the girl to be photographed in the way that she was? and WHY would those photos be posted on the Internet!? Was Sarah UNAWARE of the photos? Did she not notice the girl's abdomen and breasts appear swollen? Is the girl simply a "Rubenesque" figure?!
It does not make sense that Sarah, if she's trying to "hide" the girl's pregnancy and claim the child as hers, would allow such photos to be circulated as they have been.
So this whole story does not make sense... UNLESS Sarah Palin is an outright fool, in addition to being a liar. She seems smarter than that.
WHAT is the truth? WHICH is the mother?
Further, it is VERY hard to believe that the TRUTH would not come out, by way of "an anonymous source" from the hospital or medical team that assisted in the birth of Trig, *IF* the mother were really Bristol Palin instead of Sarah! It is too far-fetched to think that any cover-up would extend to include hospital and medical personnel!
So this story just does not seem to make sense. Hope someone can determine what is the truth; there is just too much innuendo and confusion going on in BOTH candidates' campaigns this election!
It is utterly appalling that seemingly normal people would stoop to this kind of nonsense: who is the mother, was the child neglected during birth, was this an attempt at a "fundamentalist abortion," etc., etc. Next thing ya know, you idiots will toss out the idea that Sarah Palin is actually a robotic android created in a secret Republican laboratory, or maybe that she is actually an alien being from some distant star system. Or, how about she is actually the Bride of Chuckie and was pregnant with his abhorrent spawn.
I am shocked and sickened by every empty-headed lowlife who has contributed to this foul attempt at character and moral assassination. Sarah Palin deserves better than this.
foflmao Which Is It?
If someone told you Mars was made out of buttermilk would you believe that too???
The baby is Sarahs 5th child.
Re: "Several well-respected physicians spoke with my physician husband on different occasions and came up with the same conclusion: she was trying to kill the baby." ...
Lovely that you bunch of folks who have one fact to go on have, in your great wisdom, (because, after all, you do have advanced degrees and docorates), decided you could read someone's mind. NO wonder you like your all-senators-all-the-time ticket.
Gee, couldn't be that Sarah Palin felt a deep commitment to serve her state's people at this Governor's meeting, and, after giving birth four other times, KNOWING HER OWN BODY, and talking to her doctor believed it would be OK to fly.
By the way, I saw that Obama wasn't wearing his lapel pin again. And so I talked with a few folks about that. And, you'll be glad to hear that we now know that this William Ayers loving, Tony Rezko dealing, Jeremiah Wright 20-year-church-going, self-described "citizen of the world," possibly Kenya-born, Islamic-world educated Hitler temple recreating, amazing public speaker is planning to start lining WWII veterans up and shooting them on the capital mall, starting at 3 a.m. Jan. 23, 2009.
Sad when my scenario arguably has more merit than yours.
Thing is, I didn't even dislike Obama that much...that is, until his campaign started its absolutely VILE attack on this hard-working mother of five, a fighter who has a proven record of change and ethics reform despite the utterly ingrained Ol' Boys Network of her state.
Tarnishing her reputation? No, you're just resetting the bar on how low liberals and the lib media will go to win an election, even if they have to drag our country into moral ruin to do it.
If you guys are having so much trouble digging up dirt on Palin, here's a tidbit you might be able to use: She loves America and believes its the best country in the whole, entire world. How ghastly!
As a mother who worked up till the day of her delivery (by the way a mother whose water broke and then also had to be induced) I am so offended by your lousy reporting and the moral indecency exibited here that I'm freakin' going to McCain Palin site right now and buying a bunch of yard signs, car stickers...you name it!
Rogers "merited scrutiny"...which translates to: "I saw an opportunity to attack this woman." It's hack partisan stuff created to help inflate your own ego as a supposed "journalistic crusader." Also love the way you use "heartbeat away"--nice that you've read the liberal talking points on how to attack Palin.
America is fast becoming the joke of the world. How we ever became the number one nation and leader of the free world is amazing. Especially if you consider the amount of morons we have living here.
here is a photo showing it was actually sarah's daughter who was pregnant-she is just not telling anyone it is not hers. she did not announce to her office staff that she "said" she was pregnant until 7 months and you cannot find anyone who said she looked pregnant. gotta love a vp who lies from the gate.
here is link to photo: img802.mytextgraphics.com:80
Someone called it a "Fundamentalist Abortion" my first reaction was "Republican Abortion" In addition to the Texas episode, she waited until she was 7 months pregnant to announce to her staff and the press, my theory is she had been waiting for a "spontaneous event"
this is the best you can do?
Reading these comments, it would seem that the baby was magically transported from Gov. Palin's daughter to Palin herself just in time for Palin's water to break. I find that rather hard to believe. The set of comments, taken as a whole, leaves me questioning the sanity of most of those commenting.
When the person being checked is Alaska's Republican governor, how could they not? What kind of vetting wouldn't include sending people to Alaska to talk up Republicans and make sure that Palin didn't have any skeletons in her closet that could embarrass McCain?
That's very weak. Argument by question is also logically flawed. I thought you had actual proof that she wasn't vetted. Now that I know that you were using proof by assertion without any real evidence, I can also assume that your entire article is nothing but a red herring.
For all you Truther Wannabes out there who think Palin's baby is actually her daughter, consider this article complete with photo.
Edit - the above should read "her daughter's."
As a mother of a 2 y.o. with Down Syndrome ... I find it appauling that she would leave him to go on a campaign trail! His first year will be filled with therapy and early intervention ... .He will need his mother! My son is doing incredibly well....mainly because we worked with him daily strengthening his muscle tone. My husband and I scaled back our careers to make sure he had the best start on life. I too was diagnosed prenatally... once this happens your pregnancy is automatically considered high risk...which involves seeing a specialist every 2 weeks...once you become 28 weeks (7 months).... And her OB would try to have her deliver before 35 weeks at all costs!
And btw....when I was almost 6 months pregnant...I was seriously questioned by a ticket agent about how far along I was...before they would let me fly.
Oh congratulations Cadenhead, apparently Alan has scrubbed his site of the article you posted. I guess he realizes what a total donkey's rear end he looks like thanks to his trust in you.
Well done.
That's funny, David. Twenty minutes ago you were lecturing me on "proof by assertion" and now you're completely comfortable reading Alan Colmes' mind. I'll try to post this Monday or Tuesday on why I don't think McCain's campaign properly vetted Palin.
Sorry...that should have read "would not"
And her OB would not try to have her deliver before 35 weeks at all costs!
That's funny, David. Twenty minutes ago you were lecturing me on "proof by assertion" and now you're completely comfortable reading Alan Colmes' mind. I'll try to post this Monday or Tuesday on why I don't think McCain's campaign properly vetted Palin.
And I'm sure it will be loaded with facts. /sarc
Don't go to too much trouble, as I'm sure Alan won't link to it (for fear of being burned again), which also means the "Malkinites," as you call us, won't hear about it. In short, your blog will be back to its gross anonymity as usual.
The links some people will go to to attack a political enemy are shocking. Shame on you. So much for debating the "issues".
Embarrassed here, folks. Those to talk about what that photo "proves" should have to pay for that young woman's therapy and resulting eating disorder. As someone who lost a dear friend in college because she starved herself and never believed herself "thin enough" I want to fatten the lip of the people in my party who are going after this young woman.
That photo is from 2006.
I'll say it again.
2006.
Look at this page:
Then look at that caption. Look at the slide that follows it. OCTOBER 2006.
Please, stop this. Please. Its going to be used to paint progressives as the most hateful monsters... please, just stop.
From a comment above:
"As a medical professional who lives in Anchorage, I can safely assure you that this situation did in fact occur, and was reported in the April 22, 2008 Anchorage Daily News (www.ADN.com)...
Several well-respected physicians spoke with my physician husband on different occasions and came up with the same conclusion: she was trying to kill the baby. No other reasonable explanation could be derived from this act of shear stupidity and shameless self-promotion. A Down's child would forever be a burden to her; many have already criticized her insatiable need for a national level political position over the necessity of raising a special needs child."
Does a bed pan cleaner qualify as a "medical professional"? I seriously doubt this poster has any connection to the medical community, not counting the physicians she sees for her delusions.
This is the kind of vile contemtible crap that reveals the abdject hatred coming from liberals. Obama himself declared families "off limits", but that apparently applies only to his family and not his opposition. I very much doubt the left wants anyone delving into Michelle Obama's past, or opening up their daughters to public ridicule and scrutiny. But you would do well to remember that both the goose and gander are subject ot the same treatment.
For me, this is the bottom line:
Because of his advanced age, there is a very real chance that McCain could be stricken by a disabling medical condition or, God forbid, even die in office.
Who would then be commander in chief and in charge of national security? A totally unknown and untested political rookie, a young woman who was selected by the president, not by anyone's vote.
It's utter insanity. And as dangerous as it gets.
that polartrec.com article was from someone who googled Palin and learned she was pregnant and simply included that in her story. By the layers of clothing one couldn't conclude anything by the posted image.
Do you really think that this family believes they could pass off their daughter's pregnancy as the mothers? Doesn't the daughter have friends who would tell? Something this big would have to get out.
Another liberal cock bag.
Rogers scratches head, "What kind of vetting wouldn't include sending people to Alaska to talk up Republicans and make sure that Palin didn't have any skeletons in her closet that could embarrass McCain?"
National Agency check, which includes all local, state and federal law enforcement, and all intelligence agencies; e.g., CIA, DIA, NSA, NSC, etc.
If she has skeletons, these agencies know, otherwise it is hearsay, and fully expected from the muckraking socialists who call themselves "Progressive Democrats".
Meanwhile, out of the other collective mouth, in the other collective face, they whine about "Negative Politics", like the scurrilous hypocrites they inveterately happen to be!
Cadenhead, why don't you get your facts straight. You wrote:
Palin was attending an energy conference in Texas on April 18 when her water broke four weeks before her due date
The article YOU POSTED says:
Palin said she felt fine but had leaked amniotic fluid
So, where is your proof her 'water broke'?
I had heard about this "son or grandson" rumor. I was prepared to pass it off as just mudslinging when I did read the April 27 blog by the woman who flew with Palin back to Alaska after she gave the speech when her water broke. All that was said was that Palin was pregnant and flying with her younger daughter. The photos of Palin show her bundled up, so she could have been pregnant or simply said she was pregnant. No clear evidence there.
It's interesting what the blogger did NOT say - that Palin was in labor and ready to give birth. I've been pregnant and had my water break over a day before giving birth. Maybe I'm atypical, but I went into labor right away, and there is no way I would have just been hanging around an airport and taking long flights after this happened. I was grunting and eventually screaming for drugs!
After reading the blog that supposedly put the rumors to rest, I'm now more convinced that they may have some credibility. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.
Palin made a "choice" as a woman. Either that, or she acted in a perfectly legal way to protect the reputation and future of her daughter - in my estimation, making her the perfect mother and guardian of her family.
The lying Left must raise some sort of strawman to knock down to try and discredit her, even if it is for some act that they would do themselves - like purposefully abort their viable child, or try and protect the reputation of themselves or a family member. Indeed, they do so try to protect their *impersonal* reputation by lying their heads off about a member of their own party!
The Progressive Democrats are the distributors of dehumanization, because the ends-justify-the-means to these socialist, goose-stepping party members.
Now, Palin is the neo-Juden of choice for their glassily transparent attacks from their verbal batons. This is so representative of party fascism, and which they will evolve into national fascism (national socialism) when they take power.
You saw it yourselves ... with white columns in the background, perfectly lighted, just off-center view to add that 'mystical' quality, and the socialist's pick of candidate jerking his head back-and-forth in apparent strength, as he read from the teleprompter, projecting his voice, gesticulating with practiced timing, and failing to look at the camera (the nation) even once .... or even the crowd ...
Anyone, any mayor, any governor, any military officer for that matter, has more leadership experience than Obama! Of course, the Progressives must defame her and hope their constant/rote efforts can misdirect that she is already 4 years more qualified than the socialist's pick of a stuffed-shirt-know-nothing, but (what did Biden and Carter say?) .... he is clean (Biden) black boy (Carter).
You creeps have really done it to yourselves this time!
Anapsid:
Reading is fundamental.
You're so ready to smear in our progressive name that you didn't even read it.
Or you simply are too enamored with the idea of a juicy scandal to exercise your wits.
Let me spell it out for you:
She (the blogger) bumped into Palin on a flight in MARCH of 2008 between AK and LA.
She described Palin as pregnant. Now I suppose that it could be an elaborate pregnant suit, but I'll get to that in a moment.
The baby was born in APRIL. The flight she took after leaking amnio fluid was in APRIL.
The were not the same flight. Of course this woman would not (gasp!) describe Palin as being in labor when she met her a month before, you know, she was in labor.
You guys are killing me here. We're supposed to be the smart ones, remember?
Here's why I'll never buy the pregnancy nonsense:
The two younger daughters. Both brought out to campaign events and accessible to the press. You guys ever hear about how kids say the damndest things? You think that little one isn't going to slip if its her sister instead of her mom that was pregnant? You think a mom could convince her own children with a preggo suit or outfit?
This weekend is descending into pure embarrassment for the progressive cause. We are truly our own worst enemy. The most inspirational, dynamic and "real" ticket we've had in forever, and we want to argue about innuendo. Geez.
I for don't believe for one moment that Gov Palin had a baby. I believe in coincidences, but this is a bit much:
1. When I saw her family being introduced Friday by John McCaine, I thought my god she looks great to just have had a baby. Then I saw her oldest daughter; who looks as if she just had a baby--the glow that only a mother has after having a baby. Then I looked for a picture of the family from the previous year and I found a YouTube commercial of the Gov and her family. Her oldest daughter was fit and trim--no baby glow.
2. Wanting to know more about Palin, I heard how strong she was to deliver a speech while in labor. After giving the speech she got on the plane home. Having had 4 children previously, we're expected to believe that after her water broke that morning, she gave a speech and took a 12 to 13 hour flight home. She was willing to take a risk that she would not give birth on the plane? Risk a baby that already had special needs and put him in more danger? Not only that, I thought 2nd, 3rd and 4th babies delivered quickly--not 24 to 36 hours after going into labor.
3. Coincidence her daughter was out of school for 5 months because she was sick with a bad case of mono? I would expect her daughter to be very thin if she's been so sick she can't go to school but seems not to have lost her appetite?
A blog entry is not proof. She started saying she was pregnant in March. There is no mention of her preganacy before that. There is more evidence to support the rumor than there is evidence to refute it.
See? It doesn't matter that this issue is made up in order to revile and dehumanize for party over truth.
Notice the medical expertise from the Progressives? They only acknowledge that when your water breaks, you are going into labor. Any recognition that it may take a day or more is completely ignored, like the blinkered donkeys they just happen to be. Ancedotal evidence whizzes right past their collective-head-in-the-sand attitudes.
They insist that either Palin endangered her child, tried a 'natural' abortion, or tried to protect her daughter's reputation ... something normal human beings do ... even Progressive Democrats. However, when a Progressive Democrat practices infanticide, it is perfectly okay, and at worst for the 'best'. Millions of Progressives lie through their collective teeth in defending the reputation of their party members - NO MATTER HOW EVIL THE PRACTICE (Studds' pedophilia and Franks' male prostitution ring)!
If you happen to be a Republican (the Progressive's neo-Juden) though, you can be reviled and dehumanized for something they, themselves, would do without a thought!
Two-faced, lying hypocrites is what the term "Progressive Democrat" has come to mean ...
I experienced a slow leak of amniotic fluid during the birth of my first child. (It was two weeks before my due date.) I called my OB/GYN, and she indicated that I should come to the hospital. I did so, and after verifying that I was, in fact, leaking amniotic fluid, and performing stress testing on the baby, my practitioner and I discussed the options, and she allowed me to wait and see if labor would naturally progress, rather than immediately inducing labor. I did a lot of walking to try to get the labor to progress over that first day. The next day, I again went in for stress-testing on the baby, and consulted again with my OB/GYN. Labor was still not progressing, but the baby was not under any duress, so I opted to have a cervical ripening gel applied, but no induction. Another day, and more walking later, I went into the hospital again for stress monitoring. Still the baby was fine, but labor was not progressing. I opted to induce labor the following morning via pitocin. It was a full THREE days after I began leaking fluid before my son was born.
If it is a slow leak of amniotic fluid, and the baby is nearly full term, the main risk that is run to the baby is infection. I do not consider my actions reckless in not inducing labor immediately. I felt comfortable that my son was being monitored, and I feel I made the right choice in giving nature time to take its course. Even though I eventually induced labor, never did I feel that my son was put at risk by my reticence to induce labor immediately. My son was and is the perfect picture of health. I delivered him vaginally with no epidural. My OB/GYN conjectured that the tear in my sac was high and small, so I did not feel at all like I was in labor. My contractions were there, but VERY weak. I was as comfortable as any 8 1/2 month pregnant woman could be.
If Sarah Palin experienced a similar phenomenon, I could see how she could travel. I don't think anyone can speak to her experience unless they have been there. I was in a similar place, and even though it was surreal, I can say from first-hand experience that one does not necessarily experience full-blown labor just because one is leaking amniotic fluid.
Those so-called conservatives (probably Pawlenty and Romney sore losers) should just leave Governor Palin alone.
It's her body, her choice, and Governor Palin should be able to risk complications, miscarriage, or whatever, and fly back to the private home in Alaska that she paid for is she wants to.
I for one think it is admirable how Governor Palin doesn't let social tradition prevent her from leaving her 4-month-old special needs child in the hands of others while she runs off to pursue an ambitious (albeit symbolic) career in politics.
And so what? Even if the Governor's suprise third-term pregnancy was really cover for the pregnancy of her eldest daughter, that's really cool the way she could put her whole career at risk like that, all in the name of family devotion.
If the Governor had been a Democrat, she probably would have made the state pay for her delivery at a public hospital--and put her daughter on the pill, which is a sin of course, and leads to promiscuity.
The comments from the Washington Times Commentor makes no sense. Palin stated she was not in labor and the Commentor used the fact that she was hospitalized and induced to prove that she was. The induction is what started the labor...some people will use shoddy quotes/comments to try to make their point. As is the case here.
Mea culpa - it was two different flights, and I should have read it better. The April 27 blog entry by the Alaskan woman is meaningless, and really doesn't belong as an Update at all. Sandy and C.O. above said it better than I did.
I stand by the rest of what I said in my post, especially the part about being in labor and sitting on a plane for many hours. That's just too weird.
At best you have someone who is guilty of impulsive behavior and incredibly poor judgment by flying while in labor. This doesn't translate well into qualities I would like to see in a VP. We've seen what 8 years of impulsive action have done to this country.
At worst you have someone who:
1. according to others on this blog, purposely took the plane flight while in labor because she wanted her baby to be born dead. (I have my doubts about this one, but if it's true, it sure doesn't make her prime VP material)
2. OR is faking the whole thing, and this is, indeed, her grandson. Major can of worms there.
One of these three possibilities IS correct. All disqualify Palin as a reasonable VP choice. McCain could have done better, and should have done better.
They have scrubbed all internet photos to support the contention that Sarah was pregnant all along. How's about a DNA test?
I for one an not a leftie. I still want to know did Sarah Palin lie and pretend to be pregnant to cover up the birth of Bristol's baby, Trig?
It seems that it is the extreme right that is blowing this out of proportion.
I think that there is lots more about this governor that we just don't know. She should have been vetted.
"How's about a DNA test?"
I'll bet you that if your Progressives could demand such an invasion of privacy, that your party-uber-alles would ... you are exactly that kind of goosestepping fascists in your desire for socialism, and who would force such a test for discovering a hidden neo-Juden.
That's the kind of backstabbing, lying mob your collective happens to be ...
So, there's only two possibilities.
Either she put herself and her child at risk by not being examined before flying back. Not to mention, airlines don't like you to fly when you're near term, because they don't want the risk of delivering a baby at 35k feet. That was stupid. Also I'm annoyed at her husband's response that the kid shouldn't be born in Texas because "You can't have a fish picker from Texas." First of all, I think most Texans will be annoyed with that comment. Secondly, it's a special needs child, and THAT takes precedence over it's safety? And these clowns think liberals who have abortions at 4 to 12 weeks are monsters? What about putting a near term child at risk? MORONS.
The other option is that she covered for her daughter to keep up their "reputation." How very Republican of them.
Whatever.
You know what cinched it for me. What kind of mother would want her son in an endless war for oil? Her son is in the military and she was recorded as saying since her son was in the military the best choice for commander-in-chief was McCain. Yeah, McCain-I-want-an-endless-war-for-oil. I think she's a right-wing wacko and anyone who votes for McCain just because there's a woman on the ticket, if they're elected, they get exactly what they deserve for being so bloody stupid. These two politicians want to *revoke* your rights. Not give you rights. They want endless war for oil. They want to destroy our environment and there are people here who are so STUPID they can't even see it, or even worse, they try to justify it. Rights, once lost, are never restored without much tears and bloodshed.
In the meantime, if those two are elected, I'm looking into moving to Europe. I hear the Spanish Mediterranean coast is nice this time of year.
I suggest someone get a dictionary and look up the definition of fascism and socialism. They're not even the same thing by a long shot. They're only at opposite ends of the political spectrum. The current administration is approaching fascism, which is not socialism. As I was saying, too many stupid people in the world.
It is hard to really understand why people think thoughts or say things that are so hurtful to so many - or even themselves. Both sides are taking risks in running this race and deserve a fair evaluation. Lets focus on the issues at hand and diligently follow our values when we 'pull the lever' rather than wasting energy trashing the candidates and each other. It is a good thing to have debate and interaction, but for goodness sake - treat everyone with common decency & respect.
My suggestion is we drop back and kneel down and pray hard that whomever is elected to the office of the presidency, is doing what is right by the Lord of all creation and our nation.
Vote in '08.
Tracker gets personal, "I suggest someone get a dictionary and look up the definition of fascism and socialism."
(Rogers cringes ...)
The political orientation of both fascist Italy and The People's National Socialist German Worker's Party (NAZI) meet the definition of socialist nations. Perhaps you should try to understand that fact - a collosal task for a blinkered Equus asinus.
The "fascism" of the Progressives is in exhalting party over nation, and as the National Socialists did in Germany; along with presenting a universal image to hate and revile, and as Progressives are attempting in making Republicans, and all they stand for, into the neo-Juden the collective raises as the target, a replacement for the racism of fascism.
"They're not even the same thing by a long shot. They're only at opposite ends of the political spectrum. The current administration is approaching fascism, which is not socialism. As I was saying, too many stupid people in the world."
It doesn't matter what explanation I present to the likes of you or your ilk, it will be completely ignored because that is the modus operandi of the ostrich party known as Progressives. It goes to illustrate what their kind mean when they say, or use the term "democracy": if you agree with the collective, you are correct, if you disagree, you are stupid, evil, warmonger, torturer, an idiot, in need of medication, insane, and any other adjective that can be used, in the never ending litany of hate and personal attacks.
Fascism was practice by socialist nations, and the Progressive Democrats are promoting a socialist nation where the federal government controls the means of production and dictates what that production will be, what, where and when ...
There is no cooperation, no real democracy, as Progressives defy the rules of government and refuse to vote on nomination of federal judges and refuse to allow normal conduct of government by blocking legitimate changes to Federal Prosecutors ...
You all agree with those practices against the legitimate conduct of government ... Progressives are a goosestepping mob, wielding their batons of defamation, and breaking the legitimate rules of government and conduct into a million shards of useless glass ...
Not exactly fascists, yet, but practicing the tactics of fascism to establish a socialism in the USA to satisfy your greed and cupidity.
Shameful conduct, and it is going to become more and more recognized for what is ... no matter how much you try and turn me into the subject ... loser ...
The mindless haters at the Retort have followed your lead on this one Rogers, the Retort has now become the place of record for slander and hate for Sarah Palin. A women who by all accounts has lead a wonderful life, served her fellow citizens, and stood up to corruption within her own party.
You are responsible for every hateful and slanderous lie posted, this is your doing.
I hope you're proud.
"Not exactly fascists, yet, but practicing the tactics of fascism ..."
No, I take that back, and since the Democratic Party, calling themselves "Progressives", is equivalent to the National Socialist German Worker's Party before turning their nation into "Nazi Germany".
Fascists, in fact, even before they practiced their national fascism ... live with it hatemongers ...
"I hope you're proud."
Rogers has a successful thread, Rex, and that's the bottom of the line for most of the ends-justify-the-means sociopaths, even if not successful politically.
You know ... perhaps if he had taken the opportunity to acknowledge some of the irrefutable reasoning presented?
Nah! What was I thinking ... Rogers is nothing if not a yellow-dog-stooge and literally cannot do any such bipartisan agreement. That's the same with all of the goosestepping collective ... they must raise their collective arm in virtual unison in support of party over truth, nation, reality, etc., ad nauseam ...
You can't discuss reasonably with those of faith; specially political 'faith' ... team over nation is their rule and socialism is their god.
He's not a sociopath Tad, he just stepped in it big time but can't acknowledge what a stupid move he made in throwing out slander, lies, and false innuendo as fact. Beleive it or not, I can be pretty tough on politicans on the other side of the aisle, but I use facts, not contrived opinion and slander.
This is the kind of filth poitics that will backfire big time on the hard left. 25-50 year old women are going to decide this election and when they see this kind of trash, Sarah Palin becomes their hero.
I'm praying that Olberfilth pick this up next week and runs with his ususal gutter rat slime 'analysis'.
Hussein will have go back to community organizing and Biden can slide into drunken anonymity again.
And over at the Retort it is open season to trash, slander, revile in the most disgusting ways, a women none of them had heard of a week ago. They follow the lead of the piped piper and now it's a free for all of unbridled hate.
I'm sure no subject will be untouched, her judgement, her sex, her children. (I guess it's open season on Obamas children too now?) All fodder for demented, evil, haters..... but they got a free pass from Rogers to spew what ever kind of hate they wish.
Gotta love the left, they talk out of one side of their mouths and spew disgusting vomit out the other. Make sure and check the 'Palin hate' thread count. Especially the vile scum on the user blog page.
Because of his advanced age, there is a very real chance that McCain could be stricken by a disabling medical condition or, God forbid, even die in office.
Who would then be commander in chief and in charge of national security? A totally unknown and untested political rookie, a young woman who was selected by the president, not by anyone's vote.
It's utter insanity. And as dangerous as it gets.
mediawatch | 2008-08-31 11:57 AM | link
1) 72 (as of friday) is NOT advanced age anymore.
2) Palin has MANY more years administrative experience than Obama who has ZERO years administrative experience.
3) Palin is running as VICE PRESIDENTIAL candiate, with LITTLE chance of becoming president.
4) Obama,whith 0 adminastrative experience, is running as a PRESIDENTIAL canidate (100% chance of becoming president) if elected.
Get it now?
Leftie logic: the words were strung together, they make no sense, they conterdict reason,.............THEREFORE they are true!!!!!! WHOOP DE DOO lefties are smart!
REX, 4:58
They follow the lead of the piped piper and now it's a free for all of unbridled hate.
How true that statement is. Repeat, repeat repeat. The less sense it makes the more illocigal it is the more it is repeated.
These are very stupid people who cannot think for themselves. The repeat what someone tells them to say for two reasons.
1) they think the person telling them what to say is wise.
2) they think that by repeating what the wiseperson told them to say they will look wise to others.
What they do not understand:
1) the person telling them what to say is either stupid, or a propagandist.
2) the repeaters are being horribly tooled by the propagandist for the propagandists own reasons (normally money, somtime false fame)
2) when the repeaters (blind followers) repeat this foolishness they look as stupid and ignorant as they truly are.
Somtimes I feel pity for the stupid (unable to selfthink) and ingornant (total lack of knowledge) repeaters.
Regarding the April 27th blog entry by the woman claiming to have seen Palin pregnant -- her blog post says along the top "27 April 2008, Sunday Meeting the Governor on a Commercial Flight."
The baby was born April 18th. Nowhere in this blog post does it mention the date of the flight the poster shared with Palin. If it was indeed April 27 then Palin had already given birth.
Something's not right about this supposed piece of evidence supporting Palin's story.
Mr. Cadenhead, you make me ashamed to be in Florida. Thank God you're in Jacksonville.
I haven't been here before, but I have seen the screed at the Retort. You'll not be getting traffic from me though I did cross post your article over at Liberaland so that Alan Colmes nutters can see what passes for political commentary by his standard.
Enjoy your 15 seconds, and I'll be seeing you at the polls.
As a medical professional who lives in Anchorage, I can safely assure you that this situation did in fact occur, and was reported in the April 22, 2008 Anchorage Daily News (www.ADN.com).
The medical community here in Anchorage was horrified of the news of this "heroic" adventure of Governor Palin. It was an incredibly egregious decision that risked the life of Palin's unborn child. It also set a poor example for others to follow....a public safety issue.
Several well-respected physicians spoke with my physician husband on different occasions and came up with the same conclusion: she was trying to kill the baby. No other reasonable explanation could be derived from this act of shear stupidity and shameless self-promotion. A Down's child would forever be a burden to her; many have already criticized her insatiable need for a national level political position over the necessity of raising a special needs child.
Real Alaskan | 2008-08-30 03:13 PM | link
---so, isn't this in direct opposition to HEPPA laws?
McCain's Ladies: A Disturbing Pattern
Why did McCain really choose Palin. Was it the Quayle factor but in a skirt?
We have all heard about the horrific circumstances under which McCain dumped his first wife. We have all pondered at why McCain would marry some wealthy woman who he considers a cunt and a trollop. And now he appoints some unqualified fox to be his running mate. Looking at his expression during their joint conference today, a coworker of mine laughed and declared, "My God, he wants to fuck her".
Comments
Admin's note: Participants in the discussion of this weblog entry should note the site's moderation policy.
Posted by moder8 at 2008-08-29 11:01 PM |
***********
Good Stuff Rogers, elevating political discussion and all that.
Change, hope, and mindless pornographic slander.....It's the new Obama way of doing politics.
It cannot be said too often when it comes to Palin: "The smart liberals are worried. The dumb liberals think they've won."
Eubanks says she was pregnant. How does Eubanks KNOW she was pregnant?? Eubanks' blog entry proves exactly nothing.
There's a lot of smoke here. Fire? We'll probably never know for sure.
McCain's Ladies: A Disturbing Pattern
Why did McCain really choose Palin. Was it the Quayle factor but in a skirt?
We have all heard about the horrific circumstances under which McCain dumped his first wife. We have all pondered at why McCain would marry some wealthy woman who he considers a cunt and a trollop. And now he appoints some unqualified fox to be his running mate. Looking at his expression during their joint conference today, a coworker of mine laughed and declared, "My God, he wants to fuck her".
Comments
Admin's note: Participants in the discussion of this weblog entry should note the site's moderation policy.
Posted by moder8 at 2008-08-29 11:01 PM |
Wow I think you made a typo, you are talking about John Kerry right?
O wait allrsn she might be talking about John Edwards, or maybe Bill Clinton.
So little class playing up such a rumor. Search the internet and you will find her baby bump. So many of you are truly sick
Let me see the baby was her daughter's but it was dangerous for her to be on that flight pregnant. The asylum's doors were not locked this week.
Dear new readers who hate me: If it's OK to discuss Sarah Palin's decision to have the child, why is it off-limits to discuss her decision to fly cross-country while in labor? The Palins discussed the flight with the press, just like they discussed the decision to carry the child after the Down syndrome diagnosis. Are we only allowed to discuss her personal life in admiring terms?
As a Bush-loving Midwestern conservative rube who's praying we can dodge the Obama bullet, I can only say that I really, REALLY hope that you lefties keep up this line of attack.
Really. Best of luck with that!
How good was the Palin pick? Only two days later, and the libs are in near-total meltdown.
The accusations on this post are disgusting! If this is what it takes for Obama to get elected it simply illustrates the desperation of the Dems! Obama is a true lib, and, he speaks like one, i.e., he lies with incredible conviction! Do you dems really want to talk about trooper gate, OK, let's talk about troopergate in Arkansas! You wannna talk about dishonesty in a female public figure, let's talk Hillary! You wanna trash a mom and her 16 year old daughter, go do in your sick liberal think tanks and get this crap offline! This was my first, and last, visit to this site! NoBama, NoHow, NoWay!
First, to say that there is one way doctors think about a particular medical situation, and one way of dealing with it, misunderstands the medical profession entirely. Furthermore, some people do what the hell they want to do no matter what doctors tell them and things turn out just fine for them. I was told by two doctors that even a moderate blow to the head would either paralyze me or make me lose the use of my left arm after a spinal injury playing high school football, but I played a game at offensive guard one week later and it turned out fine. After four children, I trust Palin's judgment over anyone on the internet's when it comes to childbearing safety. She sure as hell wasn't trying to kill the baby, and anyone who says such a thing is a despicable turd.
I'd be extremely careful about judging other people's parenting fitness, no matter what evidence you imagine you have. It's not just morally dangerous; voters tend to react violently when they believe a candidate is being unfairly attacked, especially a female candidate who is being judged on anything but a political basis. Obama's campaign has already been accused of misogyny and it has suffered in the polls. Similarly, accusations of a lack of experience are losers when Obama is in the same boat but in a bigger way, and Palin has more executive experience than the other three put together.
I can't believe people can say that with a straight face. Twenty months ago she was mayor of a town of 6,700 people. There are more than 100 cities in Illinois larger than that.
And after that she was the Governor of her state. This is a dumb argument for Democrats - if it's true for her it's much more so for Obama, who's running for President, not VP. Keep at it, though, because the backfire will be delicious.
I found it shocking that John McCain chose Sarah Palin in the first place because it seemed such a cynical attempt to woo votes due to their gender. Frankly, I was insulted.
I keep seeing/hearing this from people, and it never ceases to amaze. A politician doing something for political reasons? No way! McCain also did it to solidify the pro-life base, but I haven't heard anyone be offended about that. Pretending to be naive so you can pretend to be offended insults the intelligence of those you mean to convince. Enough already. You were never voting for McCain, you're not surprised, and you're not offended. Spare us the drama.
Who on this planet would abort their baby just because it wasn't going to be born in the state they wanted it to be born?
Quite a few people choose to abort for this very reason. It happens to be a major reason for the tests performed subsequent to amniocentesis.
Dear Roger,
I'm neither a new reader nor do I hate you, but surely you must realize that if all you've got is:
"If it's OK to discuss Sarah Palin's decision to have the child, why is it off-limits to discuss her decision to fly cross-country while in labor?"
You've got nothing of any weight when it comes to the election. And the lack of something of substance to oppose Palin is what accounts for the fear of the Dems and the floating of these truly weak or execrable points. I think the problem you're seeing in these comments is that you've managed to combine both into one.
If you are curious to see these and other pubescent talking points demolished brick by brick please note the point by point towards the bottom of
As she so aptly says,
"Palin has chosen to raise Trig - his name is Trig, not "that child" - the same way she raised the rest of her family: with the support of her husband, Trig's siblings and "grandparents aunts and uncles." You know ... the way kids used to be raised, with the help of the whole FAMILY, not the village. Suddenly a woman with children and ambitions and ideas who actually chooses to pursue a career is a "bad" mother, "traipsing" around the country. She should be home "having teas and baking cookies," as Hillary sneered, I guess? Is that it?
"I look at Palin and I see a REAL "working" mom, one who actually worked "with her hands" - she and her husband BOTH were union members and BOTH commercial fishermen - a person who got involved and, because of her smarts and passion, (not because of her marriage or her connections) she progressed to the highest office in her state, all while raising a family.
But even before I see her womanhood, I see her well thought-out policies, I see her priorities. I see her not just talking the talk, but walking the walk.
I know you're all about the identity-politics; the race card, the gender card, but I'm really more interested in Palin's policies than her periods. And the talking points you've sent to me seem pretty lame. Politically pubescent."
To those who question my credentials, I am an RN/BSN with over 6 years of labor & delivery experience, including 4 years as an active duty Air Force officer.
I am a conservative who has never voted for a Democrat. I despise politics and politicians, especially phony ones.
My only agenda is that I can't tolerate stupidity, ignorance, lies and deceit. I believe public officials should account for their private lives as well. (Can you say Elliot Spitzer?)
The problem I have with Palin's flying transcontinentally with preterm premature rupture of membranes is this:
1. She claims to be pro-life. Do fetal rights end at 36 weeks? She stated in the ADN that her water broke at 4:00am CST. Her father also stated as such on the evening news. In no time, up until delivery, did she seek medical care, again also documented by the media.
2. She risked her son's life for shameless self-promotion. Her water broke (again according to the news) and she stayed to give a speech a full 8 hours later! Why? Shouldn't the health and well-being of your unborn child be your priority? Of course, just not for Palin.
3. This could unduly influence others to do as she did and not have the same outcome. Please ask Governor Palin: "Would you advise someone to do just as you did?" Chances are, she won't answer you.
4. If you can't be trusted to make good decisions in the most critical time of one's life, can you be trusted to make good decisions at other times?
No HIPAA violations here. All of this information has been put out for public consumption courtesy of the Palin/Heath families.
Does Sarah Palin look pregnant in photos from March and April 08 or not? I've looked at them and find them to be uncompelling in either direction. Could be a baby, could be a pillow. And some people don't show much, even after several kids. It's odd that she could hike briskly around Juneau in 3" stiletto boots in February 2008 for an Alaska HDTV special, or that she at least wouldn't be more careful if 7+ months along. She didn't look particularly pregnant there either, but she was wearing a baggy sweater, so again, no evidence either way.
What is interesting is that there is a picture of Sarah Palin during a previous pregnancy, and there is no doubt whatsoever that she is pregnant. In fact, she's huge:
It does seem odd that she would be that big with a previous kid and not big at all with a later one.
1. Just because someone ADDED a caption to that photo that is all over the Internet (showing a "blossoming" Bristol in green sweater, with a coy smile on her face, like she just swallowed a canary) and says it was taken in 2006 does not prove anything.
2. There are other photographs of Sarah Palin pregnant (as with her first child) in which she is "big as a barn"--standing sideways in a red maternity top.
3. There are NO photos anywhere, yet found anyway, that show Sarah Palin pregnant with this latest Palin kid. The most you will ever see is her in a floppy baggy parka that deliberately obscures her body shape.
4. There is so much WEIRDNESS in the details of this story that the story seems plausible, like all that cr*p about her water breaking, then her staying on in Texas to give her speech, then driving to airport, boarding plane and flying from TX to Alaska--a trip that takes many hours... Nobody on board noticed she was pregnant or in labor?! Oh, she says "I wasn't in labor, I know my body," yeah right!
5. The REASON any of this is important is because Sarah Palin has made herself out to be a "paragon of virtue" poster-mom for *Abstinence, *Non-sex education, *Non-contraception, *Non-abortion (even in cases of incest and rape!), *Pro-Creationism, *Pro-KILLING OF WILDLIFE with BOUNTY GIVEN to hunters, drilling Anwar, etc. etc.; i.e., *she* wants to DEFINE LIFE herself and DICTATE to all of us how we get to define life and make crucial life-decisions.
6. If Sarah Palin is lying about who is the mother of Trig (WHO names their kid TRIG & TRAK, by the way??), she is a liar & fraud that we do not need in the White House.
"I know you're all about the identity-politics; the race card, the gender card ..."
It is a far more insidious effort than that. It is a concerted attempt to end capitalism in the USA and substitute a single party rule under a socialistic system. Already, the federal government controls business through various offices intended to tax as much as possible through excise, control who is employed, demand governmental compliance with rules and regulations which interfere with business, ad nauseam. They demand that business not employ unless that person is forced to submit personal information to the government; an extortion you socialists completely ignore, and while you whine about government requesting information from phone companies ... REQUESTING ... not dictatorially demanding private, personal information in order to take taxes before those taxes are due ... but in order to help protect the nation. Progressives use that to defame and revile in order to subvert the success of a war all of the USA is fighting.
That subversion of the constitution, and others, is just the start for the "democratic" mob, rioting in the virtual streets to get more and more benefits. The most recent chicken-in-the-pot from Democrats being "FREE" medical care and the socialization of 1/4 to 1/3 of the nation's private economy in the process ...
Communism is the goal of Progressive Democrats - the perfect socialism where they can abort on demand, euthanize on demand, and conduct themselves in any sexual manner they care to ...
... and in their terminal stupidity, they think it is Republicans whom Islam hates as the "Great Satan"!
as an independent centrist -- who is also in the same age
cohort as both Palin and Obama (43-48) -- I have reservations that
EITHER one has any business being on the tickets for their respective parties. Based not on any inherent lack of ability, but on lack of experience. Does anyone share my qualms about either
one of these two possibly being a future commander-in-chief
during some unknown future domestic or foreign disaster/
or dispute?
Or is this kind of question going to fuel only a typical
right or left response. Is their anyone left in the middle
like me?
A challenge for my friends.
I'm trying to get you guys to be grownups here.
Find me evidence. As in a media reported article or official document:
That Bristol Palin missed a long period of school allegedly for mono.
Because, I just skimmed the totality of the "evidence" on this issue, and the biggest part of it is built upon that brick. That would be essential to pull it off, otherwise the girl's friends would have known the whole thing.
But so far, it sounds like the origin of that "bit" of this whole construct was pulled from RUMOR.
But its almost the key bit of circumstantial evidence, isn't it?
So show me: Where is there something that documents when and for what reason that young woman was out of school.
Sarah Palin is not two years removed from being Mayor of Wasilla. She left the Mayor's office in 2002. Between being Mayor of Wasilla and Governor of Alaska, she ran for Lt Governor and lost in the primary, and Chaired the Alaska Oil and Gas Conservation Commission from 2003 to 2004. She resigned from the commission because of what she felt was a lack of ethics in her fellow Republicans, and filed formal complaints against several Republicans. In 2006, she ran for Governor.
It is telling, because Obama came up in the dirtiest, most corrupt political system in the last 60 years, the Chicago machine. Obama was surrounded by corruption far greater than that surrounding Palin. What did Obama do? What whistles did Obama blow? None.
If you want to bring judgment into this election, will somebody tell me how it is good judgment to associate with an unrepentant domestic terrorist? Sure Obama was eight when Bill Ayres was blowing up buildings, but Obama was a thirty-four year old adult when he kicked off his political career in Ayres house. He continued to work with him at the Annenberg Challenge even after Ayres reprehensible comments to the New York Times published on September 11th, 2001 (while New Yorkers lept to their deaths rather than burning alive). Even that, and Ayres' book (published on the last day of the pre-9/11 era, September 10, 2001), where he comments "'Everything was absolutely ideal on the day I bombed the Pentagon", was not enough for Obama to break ties with Ayres. Instead, the next year Obama granted money from the Woods Fund he chaired to Ayres' wife's employer.
Staggering, just staggering.
John, I'm not in the middle, but my 78 yr old mother has always been a moderate republican, one who believes in pro-choice bit fiscally usually agrees with the republicans. In fact during her lifetime she has NEVER voted for a democrat for president. Up until Friday she was going to vote for McCain because of his experience but wasn't very excited about it.
Well the Palin pick just cost McCain her vote. She said that when she heard the news her jaw just dropped in shock. She was insulted. Palin may have been a Gov. but the entire population of Alaska is smaller than Columbus, Ohio where my mother lives. She said most of her friends (some much more conservative than she is) were equally stunned, and deeply disappointed.
McCain may have gotten the evangelicals charged up, but he just blew it with moderate republicans if he lost my mother's vote.
Real Alaskan - get over yourself. You're trying to establish reality from tiny slices of information and it's ridiculous. You don't know who she talked to, what she was actually going through, or why she did anything. Stop lording your supposed expertise and "concern" over her and us and stop trying to dictate to the world what is right and moral. I could give a damn about your credentials; you're a bore and a busybody, and you're about as conservative as Rogers is. Conservatives don't spend their time trying to impose their belief systems on complete strangers even if they're well-informed about them and their lives, which you're not.
You weren't there, you don't know squat about Palin or her situation, and you're in no position to pass judgment on any of this.
Rogers staggers under the consequences of his actions, and says, "Are we only allowed to discuss her personal life in admiring terms?"
How about Obama's personal life? Is the judgement to associate with an American terrorist, who brags of his violence and wishes he had done more, equivalent to risking a flight to be home for a possibly extended pregnancy by a woman - whose choice that happens to be?
How about the judgement to brag about his religious dedication, and respect for his pastor, but then abandoning that person when the racism and hatred for America is revealed? Is bragging about, and then abandoning a pastor equivalent to not wanting to be stranded for possibly weeks in a place thousands of miles from family and friends?
Your candidate's judgement in accepting favors from corrupt mobsters; however much 'recognized' by the Democrat machine in Chicago; is in what way similar to flying home while pregnant but not yet ready to deliver, leaking fluid or not?
No, Obama is the typical Progressive Democratic's stuffed-shirt, a facade that can be manipulated by the socialistic machine and with the help of a majority of scum in the Congress, where they can slit the throat of capitalism by providing a free-chicken-in-every-hospital-bed and sacrifice 1/3 of this nation's economy to the control of governmental socialists and one-party advocates.
Judgement? Leftist, Progressive Democrats haven't any, and that is why they are despicable murmerers, backstabbing the nation in order to gain votes for their party uber alles ...
Robert Burns wisdom is totally incomprehensible to these human lice ... all dressed in their priggish pseudo-morality of the moment and praying for the heavenly government to support them for life ... a communist (however, godless) paradise ...
The judgement of the entire Progressive movement, and those who identify themselves as being such, is more doubtful than a woman's knowledge of her own body and her right to do with it as she pleases.
I'll repeat: you scum are despicable and rotten to your collective cores.
Plainly, she should have flown home, had labor induced, then stopped the birth before the baby's head made it out and had it's brain sucked out.
That way she could never be attacked as showing poor judgement by anyone on the left.
Better yet, she could have flow to Chicago, induced birth and had the baby left in a utility room till it quit moving.
Poor Rogers, you created a lie out of nothing and now you have to deal with the consequenses. Let's get a couple facts out on the table, you have no idea what you are talking about. You have idea what the thought process of this couple was at t the time and the information they had from their attending obgyn. You made a oncjecture out of whole cloth with nothing to back it.
You went right for the fetus inside her, what a man you are. Either you did it on purpose or out of some deep seated hatred for women. Freud would have a feild day with your decision to attack Palins vagina and her unborn child.
You want to talk about poor judgement? What kind of judgement did you use by attacking a woman, of whom you know virtually nothing, by kicking her in the crotch?
Here is my background: I have four kids, so I have a little bit of personal experience with pregnancy and L&D. One of my kids has special needs (autism not DS.) I also had mono as a teenage (girl).
First, if that girl was secretly pregnant (in a pic from 2006- which has probably been up on that site since before the pregnancy would have started), there is NO way she would have worn that top and been in the front of the picture. NO WAY. I see teenage girls ALL the time with bellies like that. Apparently, girls today are less self-conscious than they were in my day. Also, she was apparently in a car accident when the pregnancy was 7 months along, and the other driver didn't think she was pregnant.
Secondly, It is very possible to be sick with mono for months. I got over the worst of it after 3 weeks, but I had lingering effects for about a year. After 3 weeks, I was automatically flunking all of my classes, so I ended up taking the rest of the term off.
Thirdly, I believe that babies with Down Syndrome are smaller than other babies, and that and the fact that Sarah is in amazing shape might have her showing less than with other pregnancies. With my first pregnancy, no-one knew I was pregnant until I was almost 8 months along.
Fourthly, I probably would have checked in to a hospital in Texas, BUT I had an amniotic leak with my first at 34 weeks, and it would start and stop so by the time I got to the dr's, it would test negative. Finally, I went in to L&D the second it leaked again (at 36 weeks), and they were able to tell what it was. I didn't have a single contraction and was not dialated AT ALL. I needed to be induced. With my fourth, my water broke all of the way and even though I was having contractions, I still was induced 14 hours later because there was no progression.
Oh, and I don't know if she did it, but women are very able to check themselves to see if they are dialated or not. It doesn't take 8 years of school to feel if your cervix is open.
This is some silly sh*t, and I love a good conspiracy story. (Like Katie Holmes' real baby's daddy.) Sexist liberals are scared, and you should be.
Still waiting for some official sourcing (or at least identification of the origin) of the claim about when and how long that young woman was allegedly out of school.
(Crickets)
Are you sitting there watching Hannity and Comes right now Rogers? Waiting to see if your 'post' is mentioned.
I would hope you are wishing it isn't. Hardened political bloggers atre used to his kind of gutter attack, normal people would be shocked and horrified at's cruel gutter viciousness.
*********
Do yourself a favor, post a retraction and an apology, ask for forgiveness for such unbridled partisan hatred. As a long time friend, I am telling you this is the only way out of this mess you've created.
I don't have anything to apologize for, Rex. My weblog post is based on mainstream media sources, all of which are linked. Sarah Palin may be one heartbeat from the presidency in a couple months. Casting light on a personal decision she made in a crisis -- which she openly discussed with the Alaskan press -- is fair.
Yeah, you do owe Palin an apology. You said her water broke when that is NOT what she said. A Doctor quoted in the article CLAIMED it was the same thing. The Doctor quoted was not Palin's Doctor. You then decided that was good enough for you to claim Palin has 'questionable judgement'.
What your post shows is your questionable judgement on relying on the hearsay diagnosis of a non-treating doctor.
As opposed to Palin, who has been pregnant 4 other times, and Palin's 20 year practicing Physician.
Ugly dude, seriously ugly. You have a real charchter flaw in that you never know how to admit when you are wrong.
Rogers:
Another liberal guy who doesn't REALLY get choice.
For the record:
"Choice" means you keep your damn blog, public opinion, hands, head and government the hell OUT of my uterus, whether I keep the baby or not.
Its between a woman and HER DOCTOR whether she flies or not at a particular stage of pregnancy based on her situation.
Its between a woman and HER DOCTOR how long she works.
Its between a woman and HER DOCTOR what vitamins she takes and when.
Do you realize how retarded and hypocritical do you're making progressives look with this shit? If she pulled out of that speech, and she and HER DOCTOR decided she was in peril and that a late term termination of that pregnancy was called for, that's NOT ANYONE'S BUSINESS but hers.
Same here. She and her doctor consulted and made a private decision regarding her reproductive health at a time when the child was not yet born. That's her right.
Yeah, you do owe Palin an apology. You said her water broke when that is NOT what she said.
" ... her water broke while she was attending an energy conference in Texas." -- Toronto Globe and Mail
"She was in Texas this spring when her water broke. Rather than staying there to have the baby, she jumped on a plan for an 11-hour flight back to Alaska, so her baby would be a 'Alaskan-born.'" -- Gregg Erickson, columnist for the Anchorage Daily News
"The governor's water broke during the energy conference ..." -- Alaska TV station KTUU
There are only 2 choices here:
1. (I believe this) This woman made a very poor choice flying home post water breaking then driving an hour to give birth to a premie, special needs infant in a high risk pregnancy in a 74 bed hospital.
2. This is not her child but her daughters (this I do not believe can be pulled of these days but surely did in the past)
Rogers, you took the lowest road possible, you chose to write a thread kicking a woman right in the crotch for no reason.
You could have came up with policy differences, you could have gone after lack of experience, you could have actually given it a few days or a week to find out something real to post about the woman and instead you kicked her right in the uterus AND drug her children into the mix to 'boot'.
Gutter politics, I guess you wanted Workbench and the Retort to become the blogs of records for filthy lies and gutter slimes on Palin.
Mission Accomplished.
Well, Roger, there is always the ancient dictum, "Judge not lest, etc."
Even after many years of witnessing the kind of willful blindness that is often the hallmark of otherwise sensible, even brilliant, people it still saddens me to see it strike.
Putting all this unworthy of you speculation aside, you need to come to the understanding that this is a done deal.
You also need to pause and look and reflect that this is an obviously accomplished and admirable American woman with whom you have deep political disagreements on basic issues.
You want to engage her on those issues, that's fine. But this sort of thing is really beneath you.
Most cases of Down syndrome are caused by a mistake in cell division during the development of the egg, sperm or embryo, not from the quality of prenatal care.
Let's see one of Obama's early mentors was "Uncle" Frank Marshall Davis (Commie, no?) Obama spent his Columbia Uni days listening to Maxists speechs over at Cooper Union. He hooked up with Ayers (Domestic Terrorist and Family in The windy city. At some point he hooked up with Rev. Wright, now nice no? Let's not forgot his PLO friends in Chicago and NYC. He sure knows how to dance with interesting people, no?
Obama was in Germany this past summer did he go see our troops? NO - real good judgement on his part - No Cams NO Visit, nice.
Have you really looked at this picture? My wife was a mess at 8 months. Governor Palin is downright perky. I don't care how much grit you have, there isn't a woman on this planet perky AND in labor.
This... is just... weird...
But the pertinent thing, if you actually read the April 22 Anchorage Daily News is that the Governor's doctor, who is a family practitioner and NOT an OB-GYN doctor, is quoted as saying the Governor "did not ask for a medical OK to fly".
So, unlike all these other wise women here who went and were evaluated appropriately by their doctor and their local OB department when they were having a potentially adverse event during pregnancy and made sure their baby was OK, Palin did not. Her only evaluation was phone calls to a family practitioner who delivers babies as a sideline and according to the story, she didn't even ask whether it was safe to fly and make an 11-hour trip, with more than seven of them in the air, a frightening decision from a woman who had already had 4 children. There is no way that a physician can tell what's going on over the phone and advising someone to fly in this situation would be considered medical malpractice. This may be why Palin's physician was unwilling to be quoted as saying that it was perfectly OK to fly if there was even the possibility of an amniotic fluid leak.
The other women relating their experiences with potentially leaky membranes were not contemplating a transcontinental flight.
As for those who say this topic is politically motivated, please note that the letter to the Washington Times was written in May, long before Obama secured the Democratic nomination and certainly long before anyone could imagine that a longshot choice of an inexperienced 18-month Governor would be chosen as a Vice-Presidential running mate.
I personally know that the original letter is not politically motivated, and I should know better than anyone because I wrote it.
I am an Alaskan physician married to an OB nurse. My wife and I regularly vote Republican and had in fact planned on voting for John McCain prior to him making such an egregiously bad pick for a running mate.
The thinking people in Alaska know that dishonest and unethical politicians can smile at you and look good in a skirt as they tell their lies. That's unfortunately one of the legacies of the media age where people are improperly judged by what they look like over what their true substance is.
Please bring the April 22 Anchorage Daily News article on Palin's flight to your OB doctor and ask him or her their candid opinion about whether what Palin did was wise or whether in fact she made several increasingly bad choices, starting with the decision to travel unnecessarily in the first place late in pregnancy and ending in the utterly inexplicable lengthy flight without a proper medical evaluation.
The Palin-daughter rumor might be a completely horrible lie, but you must be kidding if you think that blog entry you cite to does annything to counter the claim. So, some woman in an airport said that Governor Palin was pregnant, and that means that in fact she was? Did she look pregnant? Or did Palin tell her -- just as she had told everyone at that point -- that she was pregnant? I'm really interested in having this rumor undermined, but what's strange to me is that no one has done so yet, and you point me to a completely meaningless blog entry.
Psst...
Folks, please stop destroying the progressive cause.
Click, please:
Now, will everyone please get these off to our fellow travelers before the stupid nonsense hits the mainstream media and someone points a microphone at Barak Obama and makes him apologize for it?
Please?!
This is just the start, you know. Rogers will post more slime in order to defame and revile for politics. I'm sure they have a ton of stuff on the daughter ... we've seen some of the info from the DNC intelligence file already posted here. The husband will be destroyed, also. And, Rogers doesn't care, and along with his collectiv. They want to win at any price, and human dignity is only for Democrat's children and spouses, and the corrupt politicians needing protection like Jefferson, Feinstein, Reid and a myriad of others that federal prosecutors protect them, unremoved by the refusal of Democrats to abide by the rules of government ... the anti-democratic, anti-constitutional, anti-patriotic scum.
That's the reality of it - Rogers is a stooge for the Progressive Democrat tactic of personal destruction. They attempt to misdirect that by calling any debate over their candidate's character a "personal attack". You can't even mention his religion, his background, his politics, or his associations without having it called "negative politics".
Meanwhile, as a valuable member of the DNC's slime bucket brigade, Rogers immediately receives and publishes the litany of libels their muckraking party of propaganda had ready on ALL the Republicans who might have a year or two more LEADERSHIP experience than the gesticulating puppet the Progressive Democrat elite have
presented to the public as ready to be the leader of the most powerful nation on Earth.
One who is a good friend of criminals, and who accepted favors and support from them. One whose minister hates and damns the USA in his racist zeal. One who has 140 days experience as a Senator, and sans leadership experience. One who has propose no new legislation. One who can't speak without a teleprompter feeding him his lines ...
However, your disgusting collective would put this incompetent into the presidency for a "win" for team and to hell with the consequences to the rest of the nation ... just so your verminous party of personal destruction can "win" at any cost ...
I think the Democratic party is on the road down, down, down with you anti-patriotic, selfish, and stupid idiots as members of the "team". Good riddance to subversive trash.
In response to: Rogers Cadenhead | 2008-08-31 10:59 PM
All 3 of the stories you listed have no indirect or direct quotes from Palin. The 'water broke' is stated with no source. Palin is quoted directly and indirectly below from your original post and you have still not provided anything that refutes her description:
----------
Palin was in Texas last week for an energy conference of the National Governors Association when she experienced signs of early labor. She wasn't due for another month.
Early Thursday -- she thinks it was around 4 a.m. Texas time -- she consulted with her doctor, family physician Cathy Baldwin-Johnson, who is based in the Valley and has delivered lots of babies, including Piper, Palin's 7-year-old.
Palin said she felt fine but had leaked amniotic fluid and also felt some contractions that seemed different from the false labor she had been having for months.
"I said I am going to stay for the day. I have a speech I was determined to give," Palin said. She gave the luncheon keynote address for the energy conference.
Palin kept in close contact with Baldwin-Johnson. The contractions slowed to one or two an hour, "which is not active labor," the doctor said.
"Things were already settling down when she talked to me," Baldwin-Johnson said. Palin did not ask for a medical OK to fly, the doctor said.
"I don't think it was unreasonable for her to continue to travel back," Baldwin-Johnson said.
So the Palins flew on Alaska Airlines from Dallas to Anchorage, stopping in Seattle and checking with the doctor along the way.
"I am not a glutton for pain and punishment. I would have never wanted to travel had I been fully engaged in labor," Palin said. After four kids, the governor said, she knew what labor felt like, and she wasn't in labor.
Some Democrats are SUCH fools! With my first child, my water broke while I was shopping, and I did NOT go to the hospital right away. My husband was flying, I wanted to be home, so I went home. I later drove myself to the hospital. Labor didn't begin for me until about 8 hours later. He was born the next day--perfectly healthy--is 46, and lives in California. Look again at the 2006 photo you're building your lies on. I would trust Sarah Palin as president even if McCain were to drop dead inauguration night FAR MORE than I would trust Alinsky-acolyte, the Marxist Obama. Palin has common sense; Obama has exposed his two daughters their entire lives to Jeremiah Wright's hatred of the country they live in; THAT's child abuse. Sorry--Obama has the judgment of a gnat.
An addendum:
I think the likelihood of the baby not being Palin's is very low, even though I think the remainder of the decisions made on the Governor's part were astonishly bad.
For one thing, it doesn't make sense that the Anchorage Daily News would include the detail that the delivery of the baby had to be induced if induction of labor didn't have to be done. What of course the induction DOES mean was that there was a serious problem during the pregnancy, as induction of a premature 36-week infant is something that would NEVER occur unless there was a serious problem with the health of the baby or the mother. Otherwise, the baby would have been delivered at term or a later date. As mentioned in my letter to the Washington Post, the most likely serious event occurring here would be infection related to the prolonged leaking of amniotic fluid, although fetal distress would be another possibility. Infection in fact would be very likely given the high probability that she went both the 8-hour period before her speech, then another 16 hours during the travel to and from the airport and on the flights themselves without a proper medical evaluation.
And as for whether this is a non-issue because the baby was fine and unaffected by the poor decisions that were made, sad to say, we'll never know whether that is true or not. Because the baby unfortunately has Down syndrome, which can result in a wildly variable range of IQ's, whether fetal hypoxia occurred during the period of non-evaluation will never be known, and we'll never know whether Trig might have had an IQ of 70 instead of 60 (or less) had Palin made choices that were proper.
I don't really understand how people can make the assertion that any of the above is an attack on children. I have two special needs children myself and know better than anyone how taking the time to improve their lives is the most important thing a parent can do. I don't see how one can argue that making the choice to seek national office while they have a 4-month old special needs child can in any way be squared with the concept of family values, of which Palin tries to propose herself as a paragon. It strikes me as being somewhat hypocritical. As does the decision to fly without proper medical evaluation strike me as being at odds with her pro-life stance.
Caring for a special needs child is a time-consuming but ultimately rewarding experience, and requires the involvement of both parents to the nth degree. My wife, who as I said is an OB nurse, no longer works outside the home, but I know has a harder job than I have. I feel I honor her by reducing my schedule and helping her as much as humanly possible and she's exhausted by the end of the day when I get home. Neither of us will be running for President or Vice-President anytime soon.
I have to say that you liberal freaks are sick. I need a shower after reading your filthy comments. Shame on all of you. Makes you "progressives" look really classy.
Why don't you take time off and stop making disgusting statements on the internet. I am sure your mom must have dropped you on your head about a dozen times after you were born because your IQ is 3 or less. And then of course typical liberal jackass who thinks he is so intelligent speculating on medical issues that you have no idea what you are talking about. Your kid really would be better off if you stayed way far away. And you have a special needs child your wife must have made all the wrong choices or that wouldn't have happened right. Of course maybe in your case it is all those defective genes you carry around.
A second addendum:
Since the Governor's family practitioner is quoted as saying "I don't think it was unreasonable for her to continue to travel back", this seems as odds with the very next quote that "Palin did not ask for a medical OK to fly". The whole "I don't think it was unreasonable for her to ... continue to travel back" strikes me as the sort of legalese
that someone who knows it was definitely wrong to travel back without a proper medical evaluation would say if they were trying to protect their friend and her bad decision. Cathy Baldwin-Johnson and Sarah Palin are lifelong friends. It is a markedly different statement than "I advised the Governor it would be perfectly OK to travel back" or "I advise all my OB patients who are potentially having a complication of pregnancy to fly transcontinentally (a 16-hour trip, mind you) without a proper hands-on medical evaluation.
So, if questioned about the advice that was given, Cathy Baldwin-Johnson could certainly say, when asked what she meant, that the Governor had her reasons (not wanting to have a baby born in Texas as Todd Palin is quoted as saying), i.e. "it was not unreasonable", but when asked whether it was good advice that the Governor do so, she could claim she never said that. Any OB doctor would tell you that it is not. Please ask your OB doctor and you will see that this is true.
The shit has hit the fan Rogers, my way out is the only way out.
Stand up and be a man, apologize and ask for forgiveness.
Do it and I will stand with you, don't and your reputation is ruined forever.
JAKEW:
Lets just rewrite the progressive platform so that if a woman gets an abortion she still has her choice, but if she has the baby, then JAKEW and Rogers can get together, take possession of the subject uterus, and closely monitor us for wise and unwise behavior.
Maybe you can get all women who do not decide to exercise their choice in favor of an abortion committed to bed rest so we don't do anything bad given our "delicate" condition. Maybe you can make women provide a minute by minute log of our daily activity and a line by line report to you (oh our benevolent masters) showing our food, vitamin and supplement intake. Lets see: You can even monitor whether the car we drive, the house in which we live, or the choice of partner we've made meets with your judgment of what's "best" for the fetus we otherwise have, you know, the constitutional right to terminate.
Are you kidding me?
This VP candidate has a trooper scandal, she takes credit for opposing a bridge to nowhere she actually was ambivalent about, and she's no Hillary Clinton. Sarah Palin: Target rich on policy.
And, yet, even the men of the left cannot resist the urge to dive into her vagina and grab onto her womb with both hands. Good job guys, really.
Any OB doctor would tell you that it is not. Please ask your OB doctor and you will see that this is true.
After ambulance chasing scum like John Edwards have enriched themselves with bogus lawsuits, an OB doctor's only concern is (and should be unfortunately) to avoid saying or doing anything that could get them sued.
Well, the legs, wheels, and momentum have completely fallen off this wagon.
However, the self-annointed "smart" people worked in another angle. If it is her baby, then she was negligent. Do you folks ever learn? There is even less information available to draw this conclusion than there was regarding the Sarah's really the grandmother argument.
It's as if the progressives love a swift kick to the taint.
Come on, Rogers. Quoting three stories as if no three reporters ever made the same mistake is not just silly but beside the point. You're damaging your own cause by harping on this thesis, a thesis that in and of itself is unworthy of you and your party. You're much better off just letting it go, or better still, admitting it was a cheap shot that shouldn't have been taken in the first place.
Jakew, you're making the same mistake Real Alaskan did: you think your experiences and opinions are the only ones that matter. It's remarkably pompous of you to sneer down from your Olympian height that she's a bad person, a bad mother and a bad choice for VP because she made a choice you wouldn't have. Fine; you're welcome to your opinion. Just don't try to force it down our throats as the one true way. No one has all the answers, and if you actually did have the background you say you do, you'd know that if you got 10 specialists in a particular medical area in a room, they'd have 10 different ideas about how to treat a given patient. You don't know all the facts about Palin's situation, you just think you can piece it together from flimsy reports and fill in the blanks with what you believe to be likely and probable. There's literally no better way to be dead, stupid wrong about something. Stop embarrassing yourself and boring the rest of us.
Now that I think about it for a while, I'd bet you and Real Alaskan are the same person: you're both supposedly Alaskan with medical backgrounds, not to mention Republican ex-McCain voters who now refuse to do so after he picked your Governor as running mate, who has an 80% approval rating in your state? I smell BS and sock puppetry.
oh this is great, you hot headed progressives and your politics of personal destruction, I would like to say that smear rumors about an innocent 16 year old girl is a new low, but it is not even close for you people, that poor girl, she has to have heard what you have been saying, and it is not long before it makes the mainstream press, at least your putrid stink will stick to the Jr. senator from Illinois
you progressive geniuses have managed to turn the whole debate into:
"who is more capable of running the country, Barack or Sarah?"
this is an epic fail, at the time of posting, this poll gives Sarah a 6 point lead LOL, only 72 hours after anyone has heard of her LOLPIMP
and of course, there is the 7 million dollars McCain/Palin has amassed THIS WEEKEND
Barack should just concede now and save his dignity
Unbelievable. The article is about Palin not Obama, but all you people can do is insult Obama.
Libtards are some sick fucks...
YAY! GUSTAV is GOD's BLESSING FOR DEMORATS!
PALIN's 16 yr old daughter is a WHORE!
^LOL^
in the poll 53% think Palin is ready to lead the country, find a poll that says that about Obama
BTW when my wife started contractions, they sent us home for 2 days, this must be mostly kids posting here posing as Dr.s from Alaska, it is not like in TV where you have to drive as fast as you can to get to the hospital, most births are not in hospitals, heck they have been doing it that way for hundreds of years ;)
at the very least, she did not have this done to her child
WARNING! this video is VERY disturbing
She did more as a governor than Obama in the Senate. She went after republicans & oil companies. Obama hasn't accomplish much in the senate & he has spent the last 2 yrs campaigning for president.
The baby story is ridiculous & it starts from the far left websites, such as Huffington. They don't care about truthfulness as they just want their candidate to win so they will put anything out there to get him elected.
This is not a Democrat or a Republican thing. It's politics, folks - been going on forever. I am amazed at how quickly the Republicans forget the tactics of Karl Rove. Do none of you remember the smear seeds that were planted by the Bush camp in 2000 that John McCain's Indian daughter was actually an illegitmate black child conceived by him outside his marriage? This was a Republican against a Republican attack in which Mr. Rove created a bogus poll to incite doubt and fear in the public. The McCains were furious at the time but have since forgotten all about it and have embraced the Bush/Rove gang. Again, pure politics.
As for Palin, her labor story (and terrible judgment in my opinion) has been vetted by the local Alaska media. This isn't someone creating a poll and giving a hypothetical situation to spark a scandal. This is her life. While it may have been cheered at the time by her fellow citizens as a test to her Alaskan fortitude, fresh eyes looking at it come away thinking that she is either incredibly vain or incredibly stupid to put her child at risk. While it's only one instance (albeit a very important one), I do find her behavior reckless.
I see some are still not sure if it is Sarah's baby or her daughters.
It has already come out that the photo of the daughter was from 2006, so unless she is an elephant, from this picture it has to be Sarah's.
As for troopergate (as it is being called), I think the smear machine might want to hold off on that also, so you do not end up looking like fools again.
As a former wasilla, AK resident(pop. 3,000 + not 8,000)the truth about Sarah and what the Mccain campaign is currently doing in Wasilla to Vette Sarah is remarkable. Sarah is not a reformer but is refered to as a bully from both sides of the isle in AK government. Sarah is not as far right on abortion as the republican party may state (see alaskaprochoice.org - photo of Sarah)since she has been known to make some deals with the other party to keep quiet or not move on other legeslative bills i.e. parental approval on an abortion. Regarding Bristol and the birth of Trigg, cannot confirm if the baby is Sarah's or Trigg's but can confirm from most at the AK state fair and those who know Bristol, she is most likely pregnant now. Much, much more to come on Sarah's rise to stardom. See Syrin.vox.com. Syrin has been a voice against Sarah Palin for many years. I know Sarah and Todd well and hope this add's some validity
The mistruth propagated by the left concerning Palin's child has been debunked. However, Palin raising her Downs Syndrome grandchild would have been an exemplary instance of TRUE responsibility vs. the rampant neglect of killing any child that isn't conceived at a convenient time in a "mother's" career or will create any hardship for the parents. Palin is being responsible, precisely what this nation needs!!! BRAVO!! Don't be scared libs, it will be over soon!!!
Mikey: The widespread press characterizations of Palin's cross-country labor came from Palin herself. The governor's office issued this statement to the Alaskan press: "The Palins were thankful that the Governor's labor began yesterday while she was in Texas at the Governor's Energy Conference where she gave the keynote luncheon address, but let up enough for her to travel on Alaska Airlines back to Alaska in time to deliver her second son." So she told the press that she leaked amniotic fluid and began labor in Texas -- more than enough information to wonder what the hell she was thinking.
There's an interesting post on Talking Points Memo that has sparked more medical discussion of Palin's unorthodox decision to fly in those circumstances.
To: Real Alaskan
"As a medical professional who lives in Anchorage, (Just because you are a Dr. wife does not make you a moral medical professional)."
"Several well-respected physicians (Do they work and support Planned Parenthood? )came to the same conclusion: she was trying to kill the baby. (Surely in your med courses, they taught you about PROJECTION- where you attribute your own views on those you are commenting on.)"
"No other reasonable explanation could be derived from this act of shear stupidity and shameless self-promotion (Not that you would be able to or like having a special needs child.). A Down's child would forever be a burden to her; many have already criticized her insatiable need for a national level political position over the necessity of raising a special needs child."
(Do me a favor- either remove your head from where the sun does not shine or STFU!)
How do you know she was pregnant on that flight back to Alaska ? A bit of well placed padding would have the same effect.
A woman on her fifth pregnancy would show early and a lot. She wasn't showing any signs at seven months and even her staff had no inkling of her pregnancy. They still couldn't see any change after being told that Palin was pregnant.
The photo at your link shows no change (puffiness, bloating) to her facial features.
Four months of mononucleosis is extremely unusual of - see
I agree this could just be a set of weird circumstantial coincidences coupled with the colossal bad judgement of a woman who could one day be president, but this is so easy to debunk. Just release Palin's medical records and it all goes away.
This is great! Please, please stick with this story. Obama will thank you. A grateful Nation will remember this as your finest hour.
Keep it up Polaris.
Maybe you can ensure that Obama gets asked a question about this on national TV.
Maybe you'll give Karl Rove an excellent opportunity to say:
Tell ya what folks, we'll release Trig Palin's original birth certificate as soon as Barak Obama releases his original birth certificate.
War, economy, gas prices, health care, and a zillion other issues, but you are Bound and determined to make sure the main stream media asks Obama about his supporters' investigation into a sitting governor's vagina. You want to have Obama defend the speculation about a preggers' suit?
I'm sure he thinks: "Gee, with friends like these...."
Let the man talk policy and change, ok?
Oho! Folks.
Your eagle eyes did not fail! Bristol Palin was pregnant. And she still IS.
And now because of your rumor mongering, every news story will mention rumors on democratic sites that of a grand conspiracy theory.
Meanwhile, does anyone remember how old OUR candidate's mother was when she got pregnant with him?
What a disaster for progressives. You guys are making us look like fools.
Prepare to shift stories in 3-2-1...Palin is a bad mother because Bristol is pregnant. Show time!
I love all these men commenting on pregnancy and childbirth who have no clue about it.
1. A woman's water can break without her going into labor. My second had to be induced hours after my water broke because I never went into labor on my own.
2. You can fly when you are pregnant. I flew to my grandfathers funeral at 8 months with my first child. I did discuss it with my doctor and actually had to give the airline a note from said doctor to get on the plane. Now before you all get in a tizzy, it was only a 45 minute flight.
3. Plenty of women don't look pregnant late into it. I showed sooner with each child. I did however gain less with each one and didn't get as big near the end.
I want to know, what her labors were like with the other 4. I can't really give an opinion without all the information and this is a huge one. If she had really long labors with all of children, she would know her body. Having had 4 children, she would know whether or not her contractions were labor or just braxton-hicks. You can tell the difference after the first child you have. Also I went overdue with all of mine aside from the first (2 weeks early, then 10 days late, 2 weeks late and then 4 weeks late). At how many weeks were her other children delivered?
I do agree with the poster that said it was her choice. It is her body and her choice, whether or not everyone agrees with it. This is where I DO have a problem with Palin. Choice. IT IS MY BODY MY CHOICE. It was my choice to give birth to 4 babies. I wouldn't consider an abortion, that is my choice (every one of my babies were planned). But I have no right to tell others what do to with their body. However adamantly I may disagree with that choice. Children are a blessing, a wonderful gift. They are also very difficult to raise and take a huge amount of time and patience. Even in the best of circumstances, the stress of raising children are HUGE! I personally would rather women have options to terminate the pregnancy in the first trimester than see stories about murdered and abused children down the road.
All I can say is, keep coming with the trash talk and character assasination attempts. Regular folks are turned off by it on both sides and it only hurts your cause. The more democrats beat up on this woman, the stronger she will become in the eyes of everyday down home Americans and the more democrats will be percieved as status quo sleazy politicians. NOT what you need to gain the independant voters.
What Obama should have done, and for the life of me I cannot understand why he did not, is to have appointed HRC as his VP. We would not be dealing with this threat had he done so and the election game would be over instead of a dead heat. Now the repubs have a wildcard that is next to impossible for the dems to attack without burning themselves in the process. Biden is going to have hell dealing with this woman, you watch.
This is shaping up to be quite an interesting election after all and I can hardly wait for the debates.
Rogers: if you support a woman's right to have an abortion, you should support Palin's right to make her own decisions about flying while pregnant, no matter what you think you know about the situation. Period. Take your best shots at this woman, I know you will, but this kind of attack is beneath you.
This is starting to get a little shrill. I say again - this could just be a set of weird circumstantial coincidences coupled with the colossal bad judgement of Palin's, but it's so easy to debunk.
For everyon's sake just release Palin's medical records and it all goes away.
I agree that it proves nothing that Sarah Palin appeared pregant on her flight back to Anchorage. Hadn't she been "appearing pregnant" for a month by then? IF she were faking a pregnancy, would she have stopped faking it for the flight home? I don't know whether it is rumor or real, but the circumstances of that day in Texas sound a lot more like a mom being called back to Alaska to be with her daughter while her GRANDCHILD was being born. Hence, staying for the speech, not freaking out about flying, etc. She seems like a nice lady who would not play fast and loose with the life of an unborn child - but if she wasn't the pregnant one, then she wasn't risking anything. IF she was faking it, she COULDN'T go to a hospital in Texas, but would have to go back to Anchorage where she had people covering for her. As for staying in contact with the doctor who delivered Piper and his not telling her to go to a hospital in Texas - that makes sense if he is about to deliver Bristol's child. It may be all just circumstantial, but it is piling up - did anyone actually SEE Bristol in the few months before Trig was born? Mono isn't so contagious that she couldn't be in the same room with friends, etc. How much did Trig weigh? Are there any women out there who can tell me that they didn't show until 7 months into their 5th pregnancy? Did she show earlier with her others? And last but not least: What is her reason for keeping it secret anyway? IF this turns out to be true and not a rumor, then I feel bad for her entire family.
Mikey flatters, "... but this kind of attack is beneath you."
Too rich, Mike! This sort of innuendo is routine on this site, and of course you know what a cesspool the Drudge Retort happens to be.
Now, the total arrogance, the infinite hubris of the Progressive Democrats, is to write another Commandment:
The Sins of the Children Shall be Layed on the Republican Candidate (but you can't do that to any Democrat or you're a nazi, fascist warmonger ...)
Your friend hasn't stopped for all these years up until now, and he won't stop; even though he knows it is an ends-justifies-the-means excuse for his faith in party over nation ...
Live with that fact. You only enable the muckraking with your 'forgiveness'.
Well, now that we progressives have succeeded in getting confirmation that Bristol Palin is pregant, perhaps we can have Rogers Cadenhead, JAKEW, and Alan Combs take over for her doctor in terms of prenatal care. We can have Polaris review the young woman's medical records. Let the men of the left invade the sphere of medical advice between woman and doctor because, you know, it makes a good story and they may find something to criticize for the benefit of our party's candidate.
This is astounding, but I think I need to put it in plain english for you thick headed liberal men who obviously do not have any idea what choice means.
As a woman, I am horrified that many liberals apparently think that if they ever disagree with me on anything regarding policy, that all the things they say they believe in go out the window. Choice? Right to reproductive freedom? The sanctity of the private advice between a woman and her doctor?
Oh, we don't believe that when we've decided you're an enemy.
I don't buy that. That's not what progressives are supposed to be about. Its called doing what's right because its right. Palin may be a hypocrite in terms of her believes about abortion, but she's a woman and a human and an American too.
So, guys, just because you don't like her politics, that does not give you the right to start treating her like a life support system for a vagina and a uterus. Or treating that fetus as trumping her rights over her body. Choice means that the realm between a woman and her doctor is OFF LIMITS to policy intrusion, and I would say moreso, it should be off limits to the punditocracy from our side.
I don't believe in the death penalty. And that gets tested. When a terrible crime comes up by a confessed killer, I still do not believe in it. Its because the D.P. is WRONG. And if George W. Bush himself committed murder, was tried, and convicted for it, I would STILL oppose the death penalty. Either you believe something, or not. Changing your belief depending on WHO is the subject is not merely inconsistent, it shows the poverty of ethics supposedly underpinning the original belief.
Our progressive beliefs mean something. They're not just "basketball jersey colors" do differentiate us from the other side. Choice means that people with agendas do not get to take over my life and my body. Or ANY woman's life and body. The despicable things about Rogers' post here are many, but the damage he does to choice and womens' rights leads the list.
Rogers knows that opening the door for "authority" to pry my knees open for "the good of the fetus" opens the door to all sorts of abuses. He knows that if that woman's choice was to have an abortion that would be her right.
But the fact some of you guys cannot see past a political opponent to the heart of an issue that is at the core of the progressive platform causes me to wonder what you really believe. I wonder if you just give choice lip service so you can get laid by progressive women, or see something else in the progressive agenda advanced. A bunch of global warming misogynists, perhaps. But for me, its not a bargaining chip. Its what's right. And that means I want even my political enemies treated with respect of her right to choose, and most especially, to protect the sanctity of the realm between her and her doctor.
I have virtually never been more disappointed with progressives as I have this weekend.
PS: Lori, pull your head out of your conspiracy theory oriented butt and read the news. The Palin daughter is confirmed to be pregnant NOW. She was already pregnant when Trig was born. So Trig Palin could not have been her child. The McCain camp is making hay out of the "hateful" rumors on the 'net. Do you know there is not a single SOURCED location for the thing about the kid missing school with mono? No dates, no confirmation, no nothing. And that was the whole basis of the conspiracy theory that is now debunked. Will you stop?! Please!?
hey, listen to Sarah Palin in her own words in this NewsWeek Video that was done back in March 2008! Its very telling!
www.newsweek.com
This is Mike from Wasilla. Ok, I said right here that all sources said that Bristol was pregnant. I hope that Trig is Sarah's child as this makes the true story that she placed her child in extreme danger even more of a lesson to those who believe that her judgment can ever be clear. There is so much more to Sarah's story. Let's review her true stance on abortion and how she has handled the 2 bills that came before her to be legislated in AK. The real story on the bridge to nowhere and how about some review of Sarah's extracurricular activities over the past three years. The truth does hurt and a Barak supporter this can be good or bad. The reality is that McCain made an extremely poor judgment call and outsiders point of view depicts Sarah as this wonder woman when in fact details will continue to pour out that will most likely lead to Sarah being dropped from the ticket. Please believe me, it does not stop here. The debate is healthy but do not be fooled. McCain was. The facts: McCain's team is now at the Best Western in Wasilla Vetting all that will talk because he did not. I am 100% confident that McCain did not know that Bristol was pregnant (something still tells me that this is Bristol's second kid). I'll provide facts. Please be prepared to hear the truth conservatives/republicans as well as those democrats that may be on the fence. IT IS ABOUT JUDGMENT AND NOTHING ELSE
Note: she obviously has the international experience because Alaska is after all 36 miles from at its closest point to Russia. That's why the pick of Minnesota's governor, Pawlenty would have made the cut because of the close proximity to Canada. HA! HA!
Mickey,
Mike from Wasilla. Yes, there is ample details to the reports of Bristol being taken out of school. The fact is that she has been living with her sister in Anchorage for some time.
Mike, tell ya what. Keep your hands off my uterus whether I have an abortion or a baby, OK?
BTW, folks, here's what OBAMA just put out. He's saying what I've been saying: Stop it, already:
Democratic nominee Sen. Barack Obama Monday afternoon issued a strong statement to "back off" reports of Bristol Palin's pregnancy, telling reporters families -- and especially children -- are off limits in this presidential campaign.
Mr. Obama, campaigning here, also noted that his own mother was 18 when she gave birth to him.
"People's families are off limits," he said. "People's children are especially off limits. This shouldn't be part of our politics. It has no relevance to Gov. Palin's performance as a governor or her potential performance as a vice president. "
"I would strongly urge people to back off these kinds of stories," he added. "That shouldn't be a topic in our politics."
He vehemently pushed back against an unnamed McCain aide suggesting his campaign had any ties to the blogs that were spreading rumors before the news broke, saying he was "offended" by that and if any of his staff was involved in spreading the issue, "they'd be fired."
So she told the press that she leaked amniotic fluid and began labor in Texas
And the labor was so imminent that it had to be induced 24 hours after she said the fluid leaked.
--------------------
Timeline from the article:
Early Thursday -- she thinks it was around 4 a.m. Texas time - she consulted with her doctor, amily physician Cathy Baldwin-Johnson,...
Palin kept in close contact with Baldwin-Johnson
So the Palins flew on Alaska Airlines from Dallas to Anchorage, stopping in Seattle and checking with the doctor along the way.
They landed in Anchorage around 10:30 p.m. an hour later were at the Mat-Su Regional Medical Center in Wasilla.
Baldwin-Johnson said she had to induce labor, and the baby didn't come until 6:30 a.m. Friday.
---------------------
Let's review the facts.
1. Palin has had 4 children. (Can we assume she might know something about how imminent labor is in her body?)
2. Palin consults with Doctor at 4am Thursday, and stays in contact during the entire time.
3. Palin gives speech. (Can we assume not in pain with contractions?)
4. Palin gets on a flight from Dallas to Seattle. (According to expedia.com, Dallas to Seattle is a 4 hour flight)
5. In Seattle she checks with her Doctor and Palin continues the flight(According to expedia.com, Seattle to Anchorage is a 3 1/2 to 4 hour flight)
6. About 6 to 8 hours after Palin lands, labor is induced with the baby not coming out until 8 hours after she landed in Alaska.
7. Total time from labor started until induced birth is 26 to 29 hours (with time differences)
-----------------------
Family values or political ambition.
Choosing to run for vice president over caring for your 4 month old baby with down syndrome seems to be a case of someone who's political ambition far exceeds their family values.
I don't see how this gets so easily overlooked by right wing family value conservatives.
Not to mention praising your 17 year old daughter for getting pregnant and having the baby.
What are parents suppose to say to their daughter in regard to abstinence or at least birth control......when the kid responds..."I want to be just like the vice presidents daughter."
Joe:
I presume you're a progressive guy, or at least you pretend to be one when you want to get into a progressive woman's pants.
As a progressive woman, I'd like to ask you:
Are you telling me that I am not allowed to have a challenging job with a younger child?
Should I stay home barefoot? How many months out of the work force (where I would otherwise compete with the likes of you) would be OK for you?
So, a woman needs to put any professional ambitions on hold until everything in her family stops happening?
I'm curious Joe: Does that mean men with small children should not have jobs or work or challenges when they have a small child, or one with special needs?
Oh, I get it... let the one with the breasts and vagina stay home.
How do you call yourself a progressive?
This whole episode has been very revealing about progressive men, that's for sure. I guess I'll have a few more questions for some guy who wants to date me _after_ he assures me he believes in choice and womens' rights and equality.
Yea, think about that bastard Joe Biden who was 29 years old with severally injured children who had just lost their mother. How dare he continue in the senate after that when he had kids to take care of?
I agree with Joe Kat, Biden was a P.O.S. for not quitting his politcal career to spend time with his kids.
Its really not an attitude.
Its more about the importance of child development during the first years of life:
I am not talking about staying home until the kids are grown up:
"Although it is never too late to improve the quality of a child's life, the first three years are the most crucial for their survival and thriving. If the extraordinarily receptive brain of the child lacks the stimulation for which it is primed during the first three years, the possibility for various types of learning may be substantially reduced-- during key developmental periods, some parts of a child's brain can nearly double in size in a year"
"In the critical first years of life, children establish a sense of trust and belonging, acquire language skills,develop curiosity and experience a great period of brain development and learning. In order for this development to be successful, babies need to be love and nurturing; the essential ingredients to build secure bonds and attachments."
I am sure a man can provide the same kind of love as a woman.
But if there were a choice I think that a 4 month old with down syndrome could use both parents for the first year of life.
So my point was political ambition chosen over family values.
Thats all.
No big deal
:-/
Joe Kat:
Presumably your quoted google research points are supposed to supply the premises for the argument that you've made.
Problem is that the premises do not support the conclusion.
The problem with the premises is the sexist assumption that a child cannot get love, nurturing, and stimulation from dad, grandma, siblings, and other care givers while mom is working.
I especially liked the part where special needs parents need to _both_ stay home with the kid. With what, I wonder, are they supposed to pay the bills? And, so, you are saying too, that every man or woman who has a spouse staying home with a special needs child is making poor choices by trying to make a living to support that family? What magical world do you live in? Do you know that special needs kids are more expensive to raise and harder to insure?
Nice back pedal, though. A for effort, to be sure. Just don't message me on match.com, OK. I'm pretty sure we won't be compatible. I have a feeling my career and educational ambitions, and belief that "little missey needs to be with her little kids at home" is sexist trip might cause us friction. I don't think I'd be compatible with your secret non-progressive "family values." Be sure that you let whoever you do end up dating know about the limits to your progressive thought.
"A Down's child would forever be a burden to her"????
I speak from experience; a Down' child is NOT a burden. If every family had a child with Down's, this world would be a MUCH kinder, more loving place.
I am not sure why I am still responding to this argument with Mickey.
I think you must be an example of someone who thinks they know someone based on a few statements they make........
But my final words to this argument will just be about clarifying one thing.
I don't care if mom and dad work two jobs......thats great if they need to or want to.
The job that Sarah Palin has chosen pretty much require she not be availabe for the next 3 months.....on the road campaigning...7 days a week.
I think there is a difference between being home less because of work and not being home at all.
I am sure that you will find something wrong with this statement.
So have fun with it.
I'll try to post this Monday or Tuesday on why I don't think McCain's campaign properly vetted Palin.
Rogers Cadenhead | 2008-08-31 09:10 AM
Rogers, looks like I beat you to it. Or were you not really sincere when you said you'd post about McCain's vetting of Palin on Monday or Tuesday?
You get egg on your face yet again. Be careful of the salmonella.
To Joe Kat
Do you know how many MEN have run for public office and the costs to their sometimes very young children?
Why has this smear not been brought up against them? Find me an article where a guy with very small children or those with special needs has had to defend the decision to campaign for office. Or working long hours. Of course people want to spend as much time with their kids as possible, but why is it that women get a "tsk tsk" when they have the audacity to run for office with small kids?
You have some internal assumptions that you are not seeing past. These assumptions are sexist. Its not your fault. You've got the republicans telling you this is the way god meant it, and you've got the popular media reinforcing traditional gender roles.
I'm challenging you because you need to be challenged. Progressive thought is about making progress toward equality, not blindly serving the sexist status quo. The most interesting thing about the nomination of a woman whose policies I oppose for VP is that she has revealed to me just how much work progressives have to do, even amongst ourselves. Sorry for being so hard on you. But until you walk a day in a woman's shoes, until you see people who are supposed to be your fellow travelers say things that suggest that a different standard applies because you've got ovaries instead of testes, you probably won't understand. It hurts and it is frightening.
...particularly to serve a 72-year-old president with health concerns after two bouts with skin cancer and five-and-a-half years' mistreatment as a prisoner of war.
Rogers Cadenhead
Don't bring up the health issue, smart guy...Biden's already had two brain aneurisms.
'women relate to women, it's a simple as that'!!?? You are an idiot patrick. You obviously know nothing about women, obviously don't know any with i.q.'s above 80. Who cares that she's a woman! I'm fully aware that some women are quite as stupid as some men, even men like you. She's inexperienced and has a very odd fishy story that is her leading story; which, if she's telling the truth, seriously throws her judgment and morality into question, and if she's lying, it speaks very poorly of her honesty, morality, and political motives. either way - if the child is her daughter's, she's denying that child and her own daughter their right to the truth, causing her whole family to live a lie to protect her political standing, and lying to the public she is claiming to serve (another republican liar, not even a surprise anymore). If the child is hers, she endangered herself, her child, the airline and violated the rights of everyone on the airplane with her irresponsible and dishonest flight during labor. The airline was not even informed of the situation. There is no way they would have let her on the plane in that condition, especially without written testament from her doctor that it was ok for her to travel. If she's willing to violate so much with that flight, what else would she violate as COMMANDER IN CHIEF!!?? Every comment I've seen by doctors says neither they nor any M.D. they know would have recommended Palin act in the way she did, were she truly in labor with a special needs child. At the very least, she would have required an examination by a doctor before flying - a doctor would never say, "sure, everything is fine, just fly home and we'll pop the little bugger out two months early when you get here in 12 hours". Any responsible doctor would have sent her to an e.r. immediately to try and stop a premature birth. So, it all adds up to a pack of lies or one very weird woman so concerned about her career she endangers her child, herself, and many others (can you say huge potential lawsuit for airlines had there been complications in flight). And liberals are not uncaring about children in the womb. We take very good care of ourselves during pregnancy and do everything possible to ensure the health of our unborn children. Very few people abort after the first trimester when it's not a child yet anyway. When they do, it's almost always for very serious reasons. But, whatever, you all send your children you never wanted off to war, better be rid of them post age 18 than pre age of viable life form. Hey, they get a few years that way.
Dems and repubs,
Great site on Sarah and the many issues that plauge her.
www.palininvestigated.blogspot.com
Hate to keep it going but take a look at this picture from March'08, 4 weeks prior to the birth of Trig.
And on cue, Smile chimes in with yet another hypocritical liberal attack on a woman's right to do with her body what she wishes. I guess the fact that labor had to be induced 24 hours after Palin got to Alaska means nothing to a medical expert like you. Man are our schools failing us if this is the kind of intellect we're turning out now. All incoherent rage, no attempt at reason. Pathetic.
Every rightwing commentator has you whining Leftists described to a "T": you are frightened into idiocy and attack all women, in attempting to dehumanize one of them for votes!
Mickey, I wouldn't label myself "Progressive", if I were you. That substitute for "Liberal" is becoming even more disreputable; sounding like some communist euphemism for one party dictatorship. A party of assassination - first at the verbal level, then possibly with batons on some "Progressive" Krystalnacht, as the collective goosesteps the hate forward with the zealousness they display in this instance ...
You swim in scum, you get scummy.
tadowe:
As one of my "progressive" sisters put it on another blog recently, I am wide awake about my so called fellow travelers.
Or as she put it: A lot of conservatives do not think women should have sexual freedom. But a lot of liberal men seem to think women are ONLY USEFUL for their sexual freedom.
I will not be bashful. I've been upset these last several days. Its like coming home to find your boyfriend not just having sex with someone other than you, but having it be the family dog he's pumping. I thought I knew my "liberal" or "progressive" or "leftist" (yes, I am and I do not apologize) friends and neighbors.
I don't know them. And they don't know me, or women in general, really.
What I can't understand is this question: When has a male political candidate EVER been grilled about whether he can both be in a high office and have children? If you had grabbed me a week ago with just that statement, I would have said: "Oh, Rush Limbaugh," right?
More astoundingly, lets talk about choice: Does anyone here REALLY believe that the daughter of some other well known holder of office has not become pregnant and exercised her choice in another direction? Does that mean that we have to suffer the other side now asking candidates on "meet the press," whether any of their daughters had abortions, or use contraception, or what?
What are we coming to?
After giving lip service to the fact this stuff is off limits, we have Biden actually reduce the woman to her looks (gaffe prone, yeah, I know); and Obama has not done more to stop the press, which clearly did not heed his statements, or maybe they took them with a wink and a nudge.
If I were Obama, I would rescue the party by saying: Any media organization that does not take heed of my statement about what is off limits will be kicked off my campaign plane, denied interviews, denied access, and left in the cold. (I do take solace in my view that Obama has such stature he already commands a bully pulpit).
I am floored and dismayed.
And I'm not the only one:
I think I'll still vote. But there's a part of me that will feel filthy in doing so, as if my vote is somehow a blessing for more of this in the future. I just really wish Obama would do more to stop it. I think he will. I believe he is genuine in HIS regard for women and our issues, even if some of his supporters are not. I will be heartbroken if it turns out to be cynically otherwise.
Joe Kat said "What are parents suppose to say to their daughter in regard to abstinence or at least birth control......when the kid responds..."I want to be just like the vice presidents daughter."
I would rather my daughter be "Just like the Vice President's Daughter" than Just Like Clinton's Intern.
Question: Gov Palin doesn't appear too pregnant in this photo, in fact with the layers of clothes she appears no more pregnant than you. Did you by any chance touch her belly? Most people, especially women can't help themselves!
You are a phony. You quote JakeW as a commentator to the Washington Post as a deliberate attempt to mislead readers that JakeW is some knowledgeable public person or journalist.
Why JakeW carries no more waith than I do- and appartantley you do. Your left wing diatribe helps McCain-Palin.
With all due respect to the lady who blogged that Gov. Palin was indeed pregnant did she feel the baby move or was she basing her opinion that she was pregnant on appearance? A pregnancy belly can be purchased to achieve the look. Do we really know that Bristol Palin is 5 months pregnant or are we expected to believe this again based on nothing more than her appearance? How convenient that she is 5 months pregnant. Just pregnant enough that she couldn't have been pregnant when Trig was born. Would anyone be surprised if Bristol has a miscarriage? Would any sane woman knowing that she is carrying a baby with Down's syndrome, with membranes that have prematurely ruptured, board a plane for an 8 hour flight and not inform attendants of her condition? Could it be that she was afraid a Dr. might be on board, offer to monitor her and realize that she isn't really pregnant? I think this whole situation is an elaborate cover-up to cover-up a cover-up and either there will soon be a miscarriage or a baby will be adopted and passed of as Bristol's. If this scenario turns out to be true just how far would this woman go if she is in a position of national power?
She could have been pregnant with pillows.
The big issues from this forum:
For every fascist warmonger comment, there is a mudball with "unpatriotic" written on it hurled back. It works both ways. Don't act high and mighty. We crossed and burned that Bridge to Nowhere a long time ago.
At best, Palin is completely honest and, in this instance, exercised poor judgment. Yes, we all have to concede that point. It was not a great idea to jump on a plane given the circumstances. Fortunately, things worked out alright for the newest and least retarded Palin family member.
At worst, Palin lied in a somewhat elaborate conspiracy that seemed innocent enough at the time, and plausible, as she had no idea that she was about to come under such national scrutiny. Definitely funnier than Juno.
The issue is: was she honest and making poor choices, or did she raise a moderately irresponsible daughter and engage in a ridiculous farce to cover it up?
I do feel that accepting the VP slot would detract from a mother's responsibilities to her newborn. If she was a dude, I would say the same thing. Either way, whatever it is a VP does would certainly be a position I would not fault anyone for trying to get. Its not an opportunity many people get twice.
The most appalling part of these posts is the constant homophobia, mostly expressed by Tadowe. If you feel a mother doesn't need to be there for her kids, then why are you so opposed to having two dads?
I can't really connect the notion of abortion and irresponsible parenting. I don't know when life begins, but I think parenting begins when you decide to have the baby. I can't make sense of most of the posts on that topic beyond that, so I'll leave it alone.
As far as the issues, sorry kids, this ain't that blog. I think this is about Palin's character, which is, and must, be fair game. As would be Obama's experience.
But let's lay the one completely ludicrous rumor to rest. The party who spends the trillion dollars on wars due to (even if you're not a total cynic) bad intelligence, is not the financially conservative party. Another point we all must concede.
Whether or not Bush lied about Al Qaeda links, WMD's, or national security, or whether or not this country is safer than ever, all that is irrelevant. Did our stretched military allow Russia to attack Georgia? We can't ever know for sure but one thing you can be certain of is that those people who were prowar are not the financially conservative ones.
Sorry for the tangent. The real issue is Palin, at least on this thread, and can we trust her and her judgment? Experience, political views, character?
Has public intelligence eroded so far as to defend a candidate who would advocate Creationism in our classrooms? The woman who prays with a witch hunter?
The conservatives making comments seem to be afraid that our country will go socialist. I can see that. But socialism will not go far. It may correct the areas of our country that have severely lagged behind the rest of the world. We are embarrassingly backsliding in education and in health care, both of which are largely nationalized the world over. Our own education system was socialized a long time ago and has led to our demise. But we do it locally. Most countries ahead of us do it nationally.
We should be looking into other systems to find out what they're doing differently and more effectively, then adopting. But that would require traveling outside the US. And my most silently resounding political statement: "Point to a Republican, and I will show you someone who has never set foot outside of North America." I make a few military exceptions... but not as many as you'd think.
Maybe the fear is that a socialist government would be run by a pro-choice chemical reaction. Or a gay dinosaur.
Jesuslovesyou says, "Don't act high and mighty."
Good advice. Something Jesus might say?
So, how did it feel when Obama said, "And it's not surprising then that they get bitter, they cling to guns or religion or antipathy to people who aren't like them or anti-immigrant sentiment or anti-trade sentiment as a way to explain their frustrations. [over, becuase of economic difficulties]"
Isn't that acting 'high and mighty'?
Hillary Clinton responded, "The people of faith I know don't cling to' religion because they're bitter. People embrace faith not because they are materially poor, but because they are spiritually rich."
Of course, Democrats do this all the time - act high-and-mighty, lording it over others to elevate their own ego; e.g., just what you are doing here in your partisan effort to be HIGHER and MIGHTIER than Sarah Palin, all superior in your misdriections and efforts literally lie her into being a "liar". All for elevating your party (your proxy ego) above someone else. To virtually attack the reputation of another from your "superior", Jesusloving way!
That's why I come to places like this, to observe the unconscious and foolish criticisms presented by Leftists, and who obviously believe that these sort of partisanly directed, ends-justify-the-means lies are somehow "OKAY"!?!
Even to the point of signing yourselve's in as being Christians, when you are no such thing but rather sponsors of abortion, homosexuality, homosexual marriage and, or that homosexuals should influence the sexualality of adopted or foster care children, sex education in kindergarden, the right of homosexuals to display their private parts in public, ... ad nauseam ...
Actually, most anti-conservatives are secularists pretending to be, dressed-up as Christians so that you all can pretend to get up on your High Horse for votes over morales, votes over public taste, votes for party over nation in wanting defeat in warfare.
In the Bible, you hide behind, Jesus says, according to Matt 5:18:
Stick that in your pipe, and lay off the dope ...
You prove my point for me without me having to do a thing. Open your mouth again and push more middle voters towards the party concerned with the issues. Away from people like yourself who are scared, confused, and going extinct.
Jesus loves you, so bend over.
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